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Chapter 13: The Conclave Between Fox and Orual

DiGoRyKiRkE
(@digorykirke)
The Logical Ornithological Mod Moderator

1:Orual threatens to kill Psyche, rather than have her continuing to go through whatever it is that's been happening to her. Does Orual want to do this out of a true love for her sister, or is it just to make herself feel better?

2:What is the significance of the house across the river that Orual saw, as she makes her decision? Why would she not tell anyone about it?

3:The lions are back in Glome. Does this prove that the sacrifice of Psyche was pointless, or is there something else going on?

4:

You make me believe that, after all these years, you have never even begun to understand what the word soul means.

What is the Fox's definition of a soul? What is Orual's definition? What is yours?

Member of Ye Olde NarniaWeb

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Topic starter Posted : July 29, 2010 3:16 pm
daughter of the King
(@dot)
Princess Dot Moderator

1. I don't think it's out of true love that Orual wants to kill Psyche. She is angry and does not know how to deal with her anger. I think Orual is once again loving Psyche selfishly.

2. The reason Orual gives for not telling the Fox is he would believe that she was mad. But I think the real reason is she does not want it to be real. Because if it is real, then Psyche was telling the truth.

3. It would appear that something else is going on. Psyche did say that the king would not hinder Orual coming again. It's hard to know whether or not the plagues, lions and so forth are really from the gods or just part of nature.

4. I'll have to think about this one some more.

ahsokasig
Narniaweb sister to Pattertwig's Pal

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Posted : July 30, 2010 4:49 am
Pattertwigs Pal
(@twigs)
Member Moderator

1:Orual threatens to kill Psyche, rather than have her continuing to go through whatever it is that's been happening to her. Does Orual want to do this out of a true love for her sister, or is it just to make herself feel better?

I don’t think it is out of true love for her sister. It might be out of some misguided sense of loyalty and honor. She might see it as the only way to protect her sister. If Orual does kill her, then Orual will have the control of Psyche’s life that she wants and revenge on the person / god/ beast that took Psyche away from her.

2:What is the significance of the house across the river that Orual saw, as she makes her decision? Why would she not tell anyone about it?

It apparently didn’t have any significance as she makes her decision except to weaken her resolve for a little. I’m not sure exactly why she didn’t say anything but here are a couple of possibilities: 1. If people knew that she had seen the house it would strength Pysche’s story and they would be less likely to give her an answer that would allow her come to Pysche’s rescue. 2. She is afraid whomever she tells will think she is mad also.

3:The lions are back in Glome. Does this prove that the sacrifice of Psyche was pointless, or is there something else going on?

This time it sounded like they were farther away and it was more an opportunity for sport rather than a real threat. I wonder if it wasn’t planned so Oruel could visit Psyche.

4: Fox wrote:You make me believe that, after all these years, you have never even begun to understand what the word soul means.
What is the Fox's definition of a soul? What is Orual's definition? What is yours?

Fox seems to think it is part of the person, perhaps a little deeper / harder to rule or change than the mind. (He talks about trying to get things out of Oruel’s soul). Orual seems to refer to something that is sort of outside the person, since it seems that she is comparing the soul’s house to Psyche’s palace. I really haven’t thought of how to define soul before. Maybe the part of the person that is his/her essence and tied somehow with his/her conscience? :- I often think of it with religious connotations.


NW sister to Movie Aristotle & daughter of the King

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Posted : July 30, 2010 12:38 pm
Lady Haleth
(@lady-haleth)
NarniaWeb Junkie

1. I don't think this was really out of love, at least mostly. Though there was at least some love in it. If she didn't care about Psyche she wouldn't care who her mysterious husband was. Orual seems so determined that the gods will not have Psyche, that she'd rather Psyche died than that. I think its also a result of her anger. But she also had the idea (from the Fox) that it might be a man instead of a god--and there was some sense of honor in that. But I don't think this was fully out of love for her sister. Orual seemed to need something to vent her anger on. As the Fox said:

...you are transported beyond all reason and nature. Do you know what it is? There's one part love in your heart, and five parts anger, and seven parts pride.

2. I'd say that was because she doesn't want it to be true, because then Psyche would be right. She didn't want to tell Bardia because he--and most others in Glome--would see that as being proof of Psyche's story. But the Fox would just say she was crazy too.
3. No, I don't think so. Most of their other problems are gone, and the lions seem to be fewer and further away.
4.The Fox's definition seems to be something inside a person, something immaterial, that you can't see. Orual seems to interpret 'soul' a little differently, like you could, on occasion, see it. As for my own...that which is immaterial in the sense of not being part of the body or mind, that which responds to God and outlasts the physical body after death.

The glory of God is man fully alive--St. Iraneus
Salvation is a fire in the midnight of the soul-Switchfoot

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Posted : July 31, 2010 1:56 am
Lady_Liln
(@lady_liln)
NarniaWeb Nut

1:Orual threatens to kill Psyche, rather than have her continuing to go through whatever it is that's been happening to her. Does Orual want to do this out of a true love for her sister, or is it just to make herself feel better?

Orual wants Psyche to come home, traumatized from her experience. And, then the best nurse would, of course, be Orual.

2:What is the significance of the house across the river that Orual saw, as she makes her decision? Why would she not tell anyone about it?

The house destroys Orual's desire to believe that it is some sort of horrific monster or criminal that is coming to Psyche. Therefore, by eliminating that moment in the fog from her tale, her story is much more sincere and she can continue to believe that there are no gods coming to her sister, just something horrible that Psyche needs to be saved from.

3:The lions are back in Glome. Does this prove that the sacrifice of Psyche was pointless, or is there something else going on?

I guess that something else is going on?

Question #4 requires more thought.


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Posted : August 1, 2010 3:49 pm
Movie Aristotle
(@risto)
NarniaWeb Junkie

1:Orual threatens to kill Psyche, rather than have her continuing to go through whatever it is that's been happening to her. Does Orual want to do this out of a true love for her sister, or is it just to make herself feel better?

I think this is a pride issue. Orual believes that she and Psyche are descendants of gods. They should not mix with anything but royalty. It is insulting to think that Psyche could be the wife of a commoner. It is even more insulting to think that Psyche is probably being tricked by a thief. Orual feels that for honor's sake the only right thing to do is to end the relationship in any way possible.

Movie Aristotle, AKA Risto

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Posted : September 17, 2010 4:44 pm
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