Well, I'm not satisfied with how VDT turned out as a movie, but I didn't hate it, and I don't think it's a good idea to let the series die here either.

I don't think Walden is upset by VDT's $100 million take. Come on, that is One Hundred MILLION dollars! I want to make it clear that Dawn Treader was not a flop financially. Those of us who followed the box office thread had a long conversation about what VDT needed to make and it surpassed even our expectations. The truth is, a production company doesn't need to make back all of its money from box office sales, because it makes most of its money through video sales and TV licensing. So to say that VDT was a flop because it cost $155 million to make and only made $104 million at the box office is silly. Besides, that's only the American box office. Most of us know that VDT made $414 million worldwide. In several countries VDT did better than either previous film, and in most it did better than Caspian. As a business decision it makes no sense for Walden to drop the franchise here.

I think it more likely that they rush the remaining four movies through and then wait 20 years to remake them than to re-boot the franchise in the near future (although neither scenario is very likely). Besides, they love Tilda, as does the general movie-going audience. Do you really think they'd reboot the franchise with MN and pass up the opportunity to have Tilda play Jadis?

Remember, most franchises have a returning cast for each film. Narnia does not. They will not be looking to reboot the franchise (and cast new actors). They'll be looking for ways to include the old cast in the rest of the films (which could be done accurately and in accordance with books with little imagination). The general movie-going audience wants to see more of Will, Anna, Skandar, and Georgie, not less.

If you, like most of us on NarniaWeb, are dissatisfied with the adaptations then the obvious answer is to hire new writers and directors, not new actors (which is basically what rebooting the franchise would amount to). The blessed thing about Narnia is that each story is different, so the filmmakers have a fresh start with each and every movie. There is no need for a reboot with this series. I know some of you are sorely disappointed with VDT, and I sympathize with you, but I have three things to say on this topic:

1. The C. S. Lewis Estate's current talks with Walden are probably about the accuracy of the storytelling, which means that we are almost sure to have a more faithful adaptation with the next movie than we had with the last.

2. Most of us on NW (like me) think that VDT was the worst movie in the franchise so far, but not everybody agrees. Several NW's think VDT was the best. My sister, who hated the first two films (and who didn't agree with the changes in the third) still thought that Dawn Treader was a better film than the first two. Focus on the Family's Plugged In is on record as saying Dawn Treader is the best so far. Movie Guide thought it was the best film of the year. So remember that not everyone thought VDT was a total failure as a film.

3. We will always have the books, the radio dramas, the BBC serials, and the hope of remakes twenty years in the future. For the sake of those who like the movies, let's not wish doom upon the franchise.

Remember that the world is watching, and the failure of the Narnia movies will be interpreted as the failure of C. S. Lewis and/or Christianity. We should continue to encourage Walden to make more films, and to make them well.

Remember that the world is watching, and the failure of the Narnia movies will be interpreted as the failure of C. S. Lewis and/or Christianity. We should continue to encourage Walden to make more films, and to make them well.

I don't think anyone will blame the author, or an entire religion, for the failure of a movie. Especially when movie adaptations are notorious for being usually untrue to their books anyway. There are many terrible adaptations of Wuthering Heights and Jane Eyre, but that doesn't stop the books from being classics that are well-loved by most of the world. A movie is a movie, and a book is a book.

Anyway, I would love to see more Narnia films if they are made well. If they're not made well, then I would rather not see them. There isn't really much more we fans can do to encourage them. We voice our opinions, tell them what we want in the movies, support the movies by word-of-mouth, ticket sales, DVD sales, even literally pray to God the movies will do well and be well-made. If that isn't helping the filmmakers succeed or put in the right quality, then I'm afraid nothing will. At least, nothing we can do.

~Riella

Remember that the world is watching, and the failure of the Narnia movies will be interpreted as the failure of C. S. Lewis and/or Christianity. We should continue to encourage Walden to make more films, and to make them well.

I don't think anyone will blame the author, or an entire religion, for the failure of a movie. Especially when movie adaptations are notorious for being usually untrue to their books anyway. There are many terrible adaptations of Wuthering Heights and Jane Eyre, but that doesn't stop the books from being classics that are well-loved by most of the world. A movie is a movie, and a book is a book.

And on the other hand the cessation of further movies will likely be a good thing for Christianity and C. S. Lewis. The Voyage of the Dawn Treader flew in the face of what C. S. Lewis and Christianity are about. It might even give people false impressions and think that Christianity is all about believing in your core goodness which is not at all what it is about.

Hey guys, this thread is sliding completely off topic. Can we please stick to the topic at hand which is whether or not Walden will be making another movie please remember the respect rule when posting.

And on the other hand the cessation of further movies will likely be a good thing for Christianity and C. S. Lewis. The Voyage of the Dawn Treader flew in the face of what C. S. Lewis and Christianity are about. It might even give people false impressions and think that Christianity is all about believing in your core goodness which is not at all what it is about.

I'm not sure that's what the movie is about either, but per starkat's warning, let's save that for another thread, since I'd very much like to correspond with you about it.

In any case, I think I made my point earlier that the fact that negotiations are taking so long is an indication that Gresham and the estate are making sure the next adaptation will be more faithful than the last, in terms of both story and the Christian principles that the story is based on. From what I know of the people at Walden, they are receptive to those principles.

I don't think anyone will blame the author, or an entire religion, for the failure of a movie.

Read some of the critic's reviews again. They have.

There isn't really much more we fans can do to encourage them. We voice our opinions, tell them what we want in the movies, support the movies by word-of-mouth, ticket sales, DVD sales, even literally pray to God the movies will do well and be well-made. If that isn't helping the filmmakers succeed or put in the right quality, then I'm afraid nothing will.

-And that's all I meant by continue to encourage. I didn't say we should do more, I just said we should continue.

I'm looking through recent interviews with Micheal Flaherty, and I found this of interest at ChristianPost.com:

Flaherty: We are happy. That one (Dawn Treader) was a slow burn. It took a while for it to catch on. It did much better overseas for us but it finally ended up in a good place. We are starting to talk to Fox and talk to the C.S. Lewis estate now about “The Magician's Nephew” being our next film.

CP: Okay, so there is some talk?

Flaherty: Yes.

CP: I read online that there was some talk about “The Silver Chair” being the next Narnia film but it's going to be “The Magician's Nephew?”

Flaherty: Right. We're looking at “The Magician's Nephew” now and I think everyone has their own favorite, “The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe” being mine. But after that, I love “The Magician's Nephew” because it's a great origins story. You get to learn so much about where the wardrobe came from, where the lamppost came from, where Narnia came from and hopefully we'll get everything together and make that our next one.

CP: What's the timeline?

Flaherty: Well, we're talking to the estate and to Fox and if those three parties, if we can all agree to move forward, then what we would do is find someone to write the script. So, it could still be a couple of years.

Note the part about the timeline and the script.

Even more interesting is an interview with Big Hollywood from back in December which really gets me wondering:

BH: I believe the next in the “Narnia” series is the “Silver Chair,” what can you tell us about that? Where is “Narnia 4″ in the pre-production stage?

MF: It all depends on the box office for “Dawn Treader.” But we are hopeful and while most signs point to “Silver Chair,” there also is a possibility of “Magician’s Nephew.” That is a great story because it is an origin story that explains in great detail the origin of Narnia, the lamppost, the wardrobe and other iconic images. It also has the White Witch in a strong role.

BH: I’ve read that 20th Century Fox — “Narnia’s savior, so to speak, after Disney bowed out — has already agreed to distribute “Silver Chair,” but is it fair to say that could all change if the box office for “Dawn Treader” disappoints?

MF: There have been a number of cheesy nautical references throughout the production of VDT, but we truly are sunk in making any more films from the Chronicles if this one falls short of expectations.

First, I'd like to point out that now, from an interview with Flaherty at the NRB convention (available for viewing at NRB's website if you create an account) it seems that Walden is satisfied with VDT's progress.

Second, I see two interesting things:

1. Both studios seemed intent on making SC next before VDT was released.
2. The Walden was already keeping the door open for MN.

Michael says here they are "hopeful" to make SC, yet since this interview Michael has acknowledged that VDT did less business in the USA than PC and that MN is next, basically as a business decision. (http://www.narniaweb.com/2011/03/why-is-walden-making-magicians-nephew-next/) May I infer that SC was the studio's plan if VDT was a huge success and MN was the plan if VDT was only a mild success?

From Christianity Today:

CT: Why do The Magician's Nephew next?

MF: It's a creative decision in terms of what story we felt has the best opportunity to draw the largest audience. The box office has pretty closely followed the sales pattern of the books. Prince Caspian sells about half of the books of Lion, Witch and the Wardrobe, and it did about half of the box office. Caspian sells about a third more books than Dawn Treader, and it did about a third more box office. That pattern continues to decline with Silver Chair being the weakest book in the series in terms of consumer demand.

We just think the origin tale of The Magician's Nephew is a great one, and it brings back the characters that have proven to be the most popular—a lot of Aslan and the White Witch. It explains the origin of the lamppost and the wardrobe. The order of these books is something that few people agree on anyway. While Silver Chair certainly continues Eustace's adventure, we never knew when Magician's Nephew would come in the sequence of films. We never assumed it would be last, and we never assumed it would be first.

Finally, note Micheal's comment in the recent interview with Inside Out:

“We’re still in our conversations right now with 20th Century Fox, and the C.S. Lewis Estate who own the rights to all the books. We’re all trying to come to an agreement about which film to do next and how to film it. So, we’re waiting to see where that goes.”

Perhaps part of the disagreement (if any) is over which film to do next?

One thing seems very clear though: last we heard, Walden is still interested in making more movies.

I don't think anyone will blame the author, or an entire religion, for the failure of a movie.

Read some of the critic's reviews again. They have.

Aren't those the kind of people, though, who would have run down the movies and Christianity itself anyway? There will always be God-bashers out there doing their... well, God-bashing when a Godly movie comes out; whether the movie does well or badly. I don't think the success of any Narnia films would have changed their view on religion. :/ But the majority of people (who usually don't even know there are more books to make movies out of ) are not going to forsake their faith, or point their finger just because the franchise stops at three. Unless they are just the "finger-pointing" type, in which case, they'd do it anyway; and it's not really the fault of any filmmaker or fans. I doubt the fate of Christianity hinges on any film. God will still save who he wants to save.

There isn't really much more we fans can do to encourage them. We voice our opinions, tell them what we want in the movies, support the movies by word-of-mouth, ticket sales, DVD sales, even literally pray to God the movies will do well and be well-made. If that isn't helping the filmmakers succeed or put in the right quality, then I'm afraid nothing will.

-And that's all I meant by continue to encourage. I didn't say we should do more, I just said we should continue.

Ah, ok! That makes sense. Thanks for clearing that up.

~Riella

The Estate still wants to make the other movies too. If Walden doesn't make them, someone else will.

Someone posting under the latest Narnia Movie News article, said that she is in contact with Douglas Gresham, and that he says Walden won't continue to make Narnia films because of the poor returns, not because of any artistic disagreements. The poster also said that Walden holds the rights for the next 7 years, so Gresham won't start looking for a new filmmaker for another five years. Now, this may be a hoax, but it does make sense.

If it's true, the home disc sales were probably the clincher, because they seemed more or less satisfied with the box office. By my calculations, if VDT had made as much as PC in box office and home media, then it would have achieved profitability by now. As it was, VDT's box office was less than PC, but not dramatically less. If it had fared comparably in home discs, it would have merely pushed their profitability time line back a bit. Unfortunately, VDT made less than half of what PC made, so they're probably still pretty far in the hole.

There's also the question of what it means for the franchise, if they have a 7-year hiatus. I'm thinking they'll need all new actors, except for Liam Neeson as Aslan. Possibly reboot it with a miniseries of VDT, and then continue with a big screen version of SC. Any shred of continuity with the Walden series will be shot by then. At the same time, when Walden LWW came out, it was an instant classic, so it's much too soon to redo that one. This is all very hypothetical in assuming that the poster wasn't kidding, and that someone else will even consider carrying on.

Why is it that every time I hear good news it's promptly followed by bad news? I hope this is a hoax...

Edit

Wait a minute. Isn't VDT still Walden's 3rd highest grossing film? And beat only by the preceeding two? Great loss for them, if this is true.

Indeed the Narnia series is Walden Media's most successful/ only really successful movies.

It would be a great loss for them if they gave up now. The next most successful movie after the Narnia films is their modern take on Journey to the Center of the Earth, and that one was only just barely beat by VDT domestically.

None of their other films other than Narnia and JttCotE have crossed $100 million domestically. It is actually quite uncommon to see a Walden Media film make $100 million worldwide, let alone domestic. It will be a great loss for them if they drop it now.

As for the comment under the latest Narnia news article, I'm not believing it until we see some actual proof. I've searched for Gresham's contact, but I've never been able to find anything. I wish I could contact him though.

The best thing Narnia fans can really do right now is encourage family and friends to buy or rent a VDT DVD I guess.

I don't find that to be true what the poster said for one no one is obliged to give out just anyone information about a film before the information is actually released publicly to everyone. That would be a lawsuit against the poster if it were true. So I don't believe one word that poster said. Trust me we would know first thing before a poster claiming to be in contact with Douglas.

I think you are right, DamselJillPole. Besides, the length of those talks suggest that negotiations are ongoing, and that nobody has given up just yet. However, there may be a plan A, a plan B and a plan C for each eventuality being hammered out.

What I think is happening about those rumours is that NarniaWeb hasn't been posting new news for a while. There are other things happening of course, such as this news item from 13th July 2011, which advertises 3D VDT DVD's and Blu-ray on 30th August. And yes, this article ends by reiterating:

In other Narnia news, Walden Media is still negotiating with C.S. Lewis‘ estate to adapt “The Magician’s Nephew” for the big screen.

The present latest article on NarniaWeb is about Walden giving up, and though it has been refuted, careless Internet surfers who rarely look beyond the first page of articles and who don't check the dates, will still get this article, or any other similar articles posted on Narniafans or Aslan's Country as the latest news in a search.

When surfing the Internet it is usually the first page which gives the most recent articles and, depending on your search terms, the most relevant articles.

Indeed the Narnia series is Walden Media's most successful/ only really successful movies.

More significantly, VDT was also Fox's most successful movie last Christmas. VDT's passing the $100,000,000 domestic mark in USA broke some sort of drought they were having in USA domestic takings, and even though Black Swan also passed that mark it was only by $2,000,000 or so. Furthermore, when worldwide totals came in, and were taken into account, VDT outclassed its Christmas rivals, except for Tangled and Harry Potter, but including Fox's other two Christmas/New Year movies, Black Swan, and certainly Gulliver's Travels.

Judging by the copies of Tron, Megamind and Gulliver's travels still stuck on the local ex-rental for sale list, and VDT's complete absence from that reject stand over the recent school holidays, I'd say that VDT is continuing to do well despite the almost total lack of marketing for it. When I asked at the local store I was told all copies of both VDT and PC were out and the only DVD of the series available was LWW.

What I think is happening about those rumours is that NarniaWeb hasn't been posting new news for a while.

That is definitely not what is going on with this rumour. Jewel, the poster who started the rumour, claims to be in direct contact with Douglas Gresham, and that she had this information from the horse's mouth. So, one of 3 things is going on:

1. Jewel's a liar who makes things up to get people in a stir.
2. The Walden-Narnia series really is at an end.
3. Jewel misinterpreted what Gresham said.

Indeed the Narnia series is Walden Media's most successful/ only really successful movies.

Depends on whether you define success by income or profit. LWW is undeniably Walden's most successful film. However, if you look at the profits, Journey to the Center of the Earth, which cost a small fraction of the Narnia films' budgets, is actually more successful than PC or VDT.

Anhun, you are making allegations about someone called Jewel, but I can assure you that Jewel was not the origin of the information that began this rather intense discussion.

Jewel is not the only person who has contact with Mr Gresham, and you may be confident that there will be information released soon by the C.S.Lewis company about its expectations for the future re filming the Narnia stories.

Please will you remember that the number one rule on NarniaWeb is respect, which applies even to people who give information we don't like (or trust).

but I can assure you that Jewel was not the origin of the information that began this rather intense discussion.

Jewel's post wasn't the origin of the thread as a whole, but of this particular sub-topic. JillPole, Wagga, and I were specifically talking about Jewel's post. I didn't feel the need to start a whole separate thread, because the subject of the rumour fit so neatly into this one. JillPole (having read the post) was strongly convinced that Jewel was lying. Wagga (not having read the post) hypothesized that Jewel was confused by articles she had seen on Narnia fan sites. I said that Jewel was either lying or telling the truth.

Please explain to me: who was being disrespected and how?