I watched The Return of the King with my brother last night. Now I'm done with the (non-extended) movies! I noticed way more things that bugged me.
Would that trimmed bit be in the EE? Pretty please. Although I don't know when I'm going to be able to find and be able to watch the EEs, because I have no time now that school has started, and I don't think I'm going to be able to get my brother to watch the EEs with me (he's the only one who's read them) since he was bellyaching about the TEs being 3 hours each.

Oh, I hate disagreeing with you Mar Girl . I should mention there is more Eowyn/Faramir in the EEs though. But

Spoiler

I loved the whole Arwen/Aragorn romance in the movies . It's actually all in the appendices, but I always thought it belonged in the body of the text. In a way, I see Jackson as restoring the story to it's rightful place in the larger tapestry. My memory is a little fuzzy at the moment (it's been about 4 years since my last reading) but I think Arwen fading as Sauron's power grew stronger was included in the story that appeared in the appendices (though it's possible the films have altered my memory .

Eowyn and Faramir's romance didn't feature until very near the end of the main story and seemed a bit hurried in the books too. And in the expanded editions more of that is shown to the point where it seems to at least get as much (or as little ) attention as it got in the books.

GB

Yes yes yes! I totally agree with you Gandalf's Beard.

Margirl:

Re: Aragorn and Arwen:

We might be having a LOTR marathon with some friends soon. Should be fun.

And tomorrow is Hobbit Day

Thanks for pointing out the typo Eru . It has been corrected.

And...erm...WW :

GB

It still doesn't make sense though...

Another point:

Some argue that the Book Aragorn was too arrogant and prideful, in a way. Which, in some parts of the book, I wouldn't argue with that.

And yes, I rather like Movie Aragorn. Too me, he seemed more down to earth and realistic. Now, this may have alot to do with the times, our differences. Back in Tolkien's time, maybe Bookagorn was more idealistic, and now, Moviegorn more idealistic for this time.

Granted, I take parts from both. Too me, Bookagorn seems to arrogant at times, and too, "Look at me!", I relate more to Moviegorn. But, as your point WW, for the most part I love him, but there are a few times maybe he waffles too much. :S

As for Elrond. this part Being only in the appendices, we don;t see a whole lot of what could have been or was or etc. I think Jackson had the part done well. The Arwen dying part? Ok yes I was a tad confused there too.. to this day I still can't figure out how or why Arwen's fate got tied to the Ring... An Idea, though. Perhaps the whole "dying" thing had to do with her grief and worry over Aragorn. Plausible. Elves to dwindle under grief. My only answer to that question.

Anyways...

Well WW, many people who hadn't read the books might have had difficulty accepting that

I'm not just trying to be persnickety and convince you I'm right ; I'm just trying to point out that there are very legitimate reasons for the way PJ handled this. He didn't just make stuff up out of whole-cloth and throw it in the films to annoy fans of the books .

Peace and Long Life
GB

On Aragorn and Arwen: the book makes plain that Aragorn is a shock to Sauron. "To know that I lived and walked the earth was a blow to him, I deem," says the book version. The book adds that if Aragorn did have the Ring, he supposedly had at least some ability to wield it. Not necessarily on Saruman's level, but maybe on the Witch-king's level. That still shouldn't have been enough to overthrow Sauron but who knows.

One thing that is clear is that since Sauron had never heard of Aragorn, he certainly doesn't know that Arwen is his sweetie. Therefore Sauron would have no reason to use his Evil Mind Powers to try to kill her; he'd be better off trying to kill Elladan, Elrohir, or any other ally who isn't protected by a Ring of Power.

(*still wondering why Peter Jackson didn't make his Haradrim part Inca instead of part Aztec. Maybe because the Aztec defeated the Conquistadores a few times but the Inca were wiped out on the day of first contact. But it makes explaining the world-building technique of Middle-Earth more complicated.*)

I agree with everything you said, GB. You explain it much better than I can.

Indeed. In The Two Towers EE, Gandalf points out to Aragorn that, "Sauron fears you, Aragorn. He fears what you may become." I think what he is saying is twofold: One, that Aragorn would be become King and unite the race of Men against him, or two, that Aragorn should take the Ring and possibly overthrow Sauron himself.

Though that's another point I was unclear with in the EE's: when Aragorn retakes control of the Palantír, we see Sauron, then Arwen, looking rather dead. I'm not clear on that part... did Sauron show that to Aragorn? Or did Aragorn finally wrestle free the Palantír, and so instead of Sauron it showed Aragorn Arwen? I'm not sure on Jackson's intent here, unless it is to just show the audience Aragorn's realization. However, the part in the book, (of Aragorn regaining control over the Palantír,) even though it was very mysterious about what exactly happened there, was still one of the coolest things me thinks.

Well, I had to force myself to stop reading, but Im on the last chapter of the Hobbit and starting tTT tonight (A bit early, only 2-3 hours and Im not starting with FotR because I just finished it at the beginning of this month, so theres no point in reading it again) and I was reading the part about Bilbo's Riddles with Smaug and realized why Frodo is called Mr. Underhill in FotR, because Bag-end is Under-hill, duh, I should probably read more closely next time, though it might've helped if I hadnt waited a year and a half between reading the Hobbit and LotR

Just wondering: what's all ya'll thoughts on the Mind's Eye and BBC dramatizations of LOTR?
I love the Mind's Eye: a bit corny and cheesy at times, but well cast for the most part, as well as keeping almost word for word to the books. I love Tom Luce (Aragorn) and Bernard Mayes (Gandalf) and Gail Chugg (Gimli/Narrator/Gollum)
On the other hand, the BBC irritates me: they hardly give the narrator anything to say (but he's not that great, anyways), and they make up way too much. Aragorn is terrible, and orcs/dead people/witch king all sound like ordinary people. Anyways, that's my opinion.

I've only heard Mind's Eye's version of TT, but I loved it. I sing its praises every time dramatizations of LOTR come up.

Yes, the magic sound effects were a bit cheesy, but I'm not sure what would sound better...

Though that's another point I was unclear with in the EE's: when Aragorn retakes control of the Palantír, we see Sauron, then Arwen, looking rather dead. I'm not clear on that part... did Sauron show that to Aragorn? Or did Aragorn finally wrestle free the Palantír, and so instead of Sauron it showed Aragorn Arwen? I'm not sure on Jackson's intent here, unless it is to just show the audience Aragorn's realization. However, the part in the book, (of Aragorn regaining control over the Palantír,) even though it was very mysterious about what exactly happened there, was still one of the coolest things me thinks.

Doesn't the book have a part where Aragorn does look into the Palantir and sees something when Sauron was trying discourage him? If not Aragorn, then I thought someone did. Anyway, Sauron tried to show that Arwen was dying and that the future was hopeless. Again, if it wasn't Aragorn, then Sauron showed them something that was dear to them that was dead or in danger, kinda like Sam looking into Galadriel's Mirror and seeing Hobbiton.

My memory isn't very good these days, since I've been filling it to the brim with homework and school stuff.

Meltinalle: You really should try to get FotR and RotK. They are really good. THEN listen to the BBC one. They have really good music, and Faramir was well cast, but Tom Luce beats BBC's Aragorn to pieces. Also, BBC did a terrible job of adapting. But then, maybe that's my purist side talking. Frodo does horrible, girl-like screams several times. Sam is good usually.