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[Closed] The Star Wars Legacy (the Force will be with you always!)

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Princess Anna
(@princess-anna)
NarniaWeb Junkie

"A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away..."

Hey, guys! Welcome to our newest Spare Oom Special Feature!
Yes, I know... I'm going from Trek to Wars. Deal with it! :P

Now, I know most of you have already heard this today, but... "May the Fourth be with you." ;))

Ok, all jokes aside... HAPPY STAR WARS DAY! I thought today would be the perfect time to open a thread I've been itching to open for several weeks now. You know, a place where we could all talk about another of our favourite Sci-fi franchises! (though some would argue that it's a sci-fi/fantasy hybrid)

It all begin in 1977... when a new movie from George Lucas came out in theaters everywhere. And a new fanbase was born.

I wasn't alive back then (I happened to arrive the fall of the same year as episode six), but I know that I don't remember a time when I didn't know of the saga of the Skywalker family.

The idea of fighting an evil and corrupt Empire, and learning of a mysterious (good) thing called the Force captivated me from a very early age. Then, when I was in high school, Episodes 1-3 came on the scene. (well, I was in college by episode 3) And I learned even more of Lucas' plans for the universe of his saga.

As more time went on, I learned of video games and the Expanded Universe (aka the books). And what that opened up to me was just as full of wonder and fun as the films I had always loved. But enough about me, what about you guys?

How did you first learn of the saga? What characters do you love most, or love to hate? Have you read any of the books? Seen the shows (like Clone Wars, which I haven't seen) Which film or book or game was your favourite? What do you think of all the changes Lucas keeps making when rereleasing them on dvd and blu-ray? Are you going to see the films in 3D as they come out? What about having visited the attractions like at... was it, Epcot? (some disney place)

Remember, all things Star Wars can be spoken of in here... but keep it within forum rules. And if there are things (like from the books), try to put certain things in spoilers. Some of our friends don't know as much as others of us do. ;)

Thanks, and have fun! :)

p.s. thanks to those of you who gave me advice on this opening post. you know who you are

Topic starter Posted : May 4, 2012 5:07 pm
shastastwin
(@shastastwin)
Member Moderator Emeritus

When I was growing up, the original trilogy was a staple in our house, especially A New Hope (or just plain Star Wars). I remember Episode I coming out and enjoying it because it was interesting to see Anakin as a child (plus, Qui-gon Jin is amazing and that's not just because I think Liam Neeson is an amazing actor). I know a lot of people have harped on Jar Jar Binks, but he honestly never bothered me that much. The biggest problem I had with the new trilogy (barring the cheesy Anakin/Padme lines for which I blame George Lucas and Hayden Christensen) was that General Grievous' role in the film Revenge of the Sith was so downplayed and pitiful compared to what he was in the Clone Wars cartoon shorts that Cartoon Network released between Episodes II and III. In those, Grievous was a scary Jedi hunter who freaked me out and I thought would be so awesome onscreen. However, the filmmakers seemed to have expected their viewers to have watched all of the Clone Wars cartoons, and so in the film there is no explanation for Grievous' gasping and wheezing (in the shorts, Mace Windu used a Force crush on Grievous as he escaped with the Chancellor as his prisoner) and Grievous isn't nearly as terrifying.

I remember reading a handful of Star Wars books. I read probably the first five or six of the Young Jedi Knights series, which focused on the Jedi training of Han and Leia's children and their friends, which included Chewbacca's nephew. I also read the Thrawn trilogy, which I have been told was based on Lucas' plans for the third trilogy of films, if they had made them, and which follows the aftermath of Return of the Jedi. Those were probably the best Star Wars books I have read, and definitely were some of the best sci-fi novels I have read. I tried to read the first book of the Force Heretic trilogy, Remnant but I lost interest in it and was entirely lost because of all the ground that had been covered since the days of the Young Jedi Knights series. The only other books I've read have been the Dark Nest trilogy, which was okay but not very wonderful.

"All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a Thousand Enemies. And when they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you..."
Inexhaustible Inspiration

6689 posts from forum 1.0

Posted : May 5, 2012 4:53 am
Meltintalle
(@mel)
Member Moderator

I don't remember for sure, but I believe I was introduced to Star Wars via the screenplays, which were on a Project Gutenberg CD.

For years, my favourite movie was Return of the Jedi, hands down. Now I'm less decisive. ;)) After going to Star Wars In Concert, narrated by Anthony Daniels (it was fabulous :D ) I was reminded just how much I really liked Phantom Menace. I have fond memories of the year it came out, and playing Jedi knights in the backyard and devouring the Jedi Apprentice series.

I recently re-read the Alan Dean Foster novelization of A New Hope and I was amazed at just how shallow it seemed. (The prose was rather lame, too.) If I didn't have the actors inflections and faces in my head, I think the story would have seemed incredibly illogical and forgettable. But watching the movie, that's the way the story goes, and it works...

As for the constant tinkering and changes that seem to occur with every re-release, well... Han shot first. CG touch-up I don't have as much of a problem with, but changing the story is unacceptable. Things like that change motivations and ruin character arcs. [-(

We have hands that fashion and heads that know,
But our hearts we lost - how long ago! -- G. K. Chesterton

Posted : May 5, 2012 6:21 am
Puddleglum
(@puddleglum)
NarniaWeb Junkie

Saw the original when I was just into my teens. I remember it was the first "grown up" movie my brothers, and I were alowed to see in the theatre.
Funny thing about that now is, I can watch this "classic" and see so many flaws, bad acting, bloopers, (the storm trooper hitting his head as they enter the controle room is funny no matter how many times I see it), or the slow-motion duel between Obi Wan, and Darth Vader. But I still manage to enjoy it.
Read only a few books. The ones dealing with Han, and Chewee before they meet Luke were ok. Another with Luke, and Liea meeting Darth Vader on a mining planet I was not impessed by.
While the effects, and battle scenes are more imressive in the "newer" movies there were still too many things that raised questions.
Why did Amidala apparently not age from Episode1 to 2?
Anikin's eventual "conversion" to the dark side seemed rather lame. He had just stopped Mace Windom from killing the chancellore because it was not the Jedi way, yet then falls right into the dark side?
Anyway. I'm sure there will be other questions. gotta dash.

Posted : May 5, 2012 9:14 am
stargazer
(@stargazer)
Member Moderator

Ah, May of 1977. Has it really been that long? ;)

The world was different then...yadda yadda yadda, blah blah blah. True as it may be, I imagine it might get a little old to hear old fogeys like me talk about it, so I won't...much. ;))

But it's hard to overestimate the impact the original Star Wars (there was no "Episode IV: A New Hope" attached to it then; it was a stand-alone movie) had both on movie-making and the culture.

Sure, we had Kubrick's 2001: A Space Odyssey, which was visually spectacular but, quite frankly, boring to many (how long is it going to take them to dock to the space station?). Not to mention a story that often didn't make a lot of sense unless you'd read the book.

But from that opening scene with the starship crawling across the screen, we could tell Star Wars was something different - not only a spectacular space setting, but a fairly simple story anyone could follow. The critics panned it but the audiences loved it, and the rest is history.

The original trilogy looks rather dated now, given all the advancements in CGI and special effects, but it was unbelievable for a bunch of college kids when we went to see it for the first time....

...And stayed up late at night discussing the deep questions of the first 2 movies, like "Is Vader really Luke's father?" or "Who is the other Skywalker?" DVDs didn't exist yet and even VHS copies weren't available then, so the only option (for those really worried about such questions) was to see the movies in the cinema again and again.

I think that experience colors my opinions of the movies. I much prefer the original trilogy because the story was new and full of questions (of course, there was no shortage of theories about how it would end up).

The prequel trilogy is visually superior (and I do like them), but constrained by the fact that we know how things have to turn out: adorable little Anakin grows up to be Darth Vader, Padme dies after giving birth to her twins, Palpatine has to become the Emperor, etc.

The Empire Strikes Back disappointed me when it first came out (as middle segments of a trilogy often have plot limitations in that they set up the finale) but now it's probably my favorite of the series.

A favorite scene comes from the original...Luke looking over the desert at the double sunset. The music is just perfect. Now it may look simple, almost quaint, but at the time it was a powerful image.

Good points about General Grievous in Sith, shastastwin. My nephew has The Clone Wars animated series - which for the most part is pretty entertaining - and it does fill in those gaps between II and III.

On the one hand, I don't mind many of the changes Lucas made in the re-releases; they're his movies, I guess. On the other, I'd prefer he not mess with the originals. The most disappointing change I recall is at the end of Return of the Jedi, with Hayden Christiansen replaced Sebastian Shaw as the ghost image of Anakin. I can understand Lucas' logic in doing so, but for some reason it still doesn't do anything for me.

Speaking of the Clone Wars, fans of The Big Bang Theory know that the characters there like to refer to Star Wars. In one episode Sheldon says:

"I'm sorry but I'm not going to watch the Clone Wars TV Series until I've seen the Clone Wars movie. I prefer to let George Lucas disappoint me in the order he intended."

*Offers a virtual rimshot and ducks out for now*

But all night, Aslan and the Moon gazed upon each other with joyful and unblinking eyes.

Posted : May 5, 2012 2:01 pm
shastastwin
(@shastastwin)
Member Moderator Emeritus

The biggest problems I had with the re-released versions of the original trilogy were replacing the actor who played Anakin (as stargazer mentioned above) and the updated special effects. Aside from the fact that I grew up on the old special effects and love them, the new SFX do not mesh well with the otherwise older-looking films. At all. :P

In talking about the Star Wars books I have read for my earlier post, I've felt an urge to read some more. I may look for a few the next time I go to the bookstore.

On a side note, has anyone seen
this fun parody?

"All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a Thousand Enemies. And when they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you..."
Inexhaustible Inspiration

6689 posts from forum 1.0

Posted : May 6, 2012 1:52 pm
Meltintalle
(@mel)
Member Moderator

The biggest problems I had with the re-released versions of the original trilogy were replacing the actor who played Anakin (as stargazer mentioned above)

I don't approve of that change either; to me, it makes it look like Anakin got away with his actions scott-free, which isn't right at all. I did see a well-thought out defense of the change that made me nod my head and go, "Okay, well, in that case... maybe..." but now I don't remember where I saw it or what it said. :p

I just finished reading the Corellian trilogy by Roger Macbride Allen (thanks for the rec, PA! :D ) and it was a fun read. I'm thinking that now I want to go back and re-read the Thrawn trilogy, though, to see how the characterizations of Mara Jade match up. :)

We have hands that fashion and heads that know,
But our hearts we lost - how long ago! -- G. K. Chesterton

Posted : May 7, 2012 2:48 pm
daughter of the King
(@dot)
Princess Dot Moderator

I was introduced to Star Wars when my brothers watched the special edition A New Hope on VHS. Empire and Return of the Jedi were naturally not too far behind. My favorite is definitely Empire Strikes Back. My favorite soundtrack piece is probably from Phantom Menace though. That movie had problems, but the duel is amazing visually and musically.

I don't think I have a favorite character. It's very much an ensemble cast so it's hard to choose a favorite. Luke and Leia are good. And Han. And Yoda. And Obi-Wan. And Darth Vader. . .

Still haven't read any of the books.

The most disappointing change I recall is at the end of Return of the Jedi, with Hayden Christiansen replaced Sebastian Shaw as the ghost image of Anakin. I can understand Lucas' logic in doing so, but for some reason it still doesn't do anything for me.

Ditto. I don't like this change at all. I don't remember his exact argument for it, but I felt like it cheapened his redemption. By using Hayden Christiansen it seems to indicate that Vader really did "kill" Anakin (from a certain point of view of course) rather than Anakin voluntarily becoming Vader. By using Sebastian Shaw, it shows that Vader was not completely evil and that there was still good underneath the mask. He matured into the Jedi Master he was supposed to be rather than regressing to the whiny Jedi Knight that he was.

On a side note, has anyone seen
this fun parody?

Yes! Isn't it brilliant?

*wanders out singing "My, my, this here Anakin guy, maybe Vader someday later but for now he's small fry. . ."*

ahsokasig
Narniaweb sister to Pattertwig's Pal

Posted : May 8, 2012 12:09 pm
shastastwin
(@shastastwin)
Member Moderator Emeritus

Dot, I think that duel may be one of the reasons I've always enjoyed Episode I. The midi-chlorians, however. :P (Incidentally, what did the rest of you think of that addition to the concept of the Force?)

I think your argument and analysis of the replacement of Anakin is both sound and penetrating, Dot. Anakin at the end of Return of the Jedi has to be both older and more mature because he was when he died and if you take those away, you take away the effect of his story.

For those who have read more of the Star Wars Expanded Universe books, which do you suggest reading?

"All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a Thousand Enemies. And when they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you..."
Inexhaustible Inspiration

6689 posts from forum 1.0

Posted : May 8, 2012 12:16 pm
MountainFireflower
(@mountainfireflower)
Member Moderator Emeritus

My first introduction to Star Wars was at the age of nine, I believe, or thereabouts. Weirdly enough, I think the first one I watched was Episode 2. After that, I watched Episode 1, and then the original trilogy.

And believe it or not, I still haven't seen Revenge of the Sith in its entirety. I have, however, seen the main parts:

Spoiler
Padme's funeral, and the parts where Luke and Leia are delivered to their new families.
Don't know why I haven't seen the whole movie. When it first came out, I was too young to see it, and since then, I just haven't gotten around to it yet.

I'm not as big of a fan of Star Wars as I could be. I've only seen the films (as opposed to reading books, watching TV series', etc.) and am a pretty casual fan when it comes to them. But overall, I appreciate what George Lucas has done with Star Wars. The entire story has been incredibly influential in the world of sci-fi, and they're well-done films. And the worldbuilding involved is stunning to say the least. I write novels, and if I can create a world as deep and complex as the Star Wars universe, I'll be in good shape.

av by dot

Posted : May 8, 2012 12:31 pm
stargazer
(@stargazer)
Member Moderator

*wanders out singing "My, my, this here Anakin guy, maybe Vader someday later but for now he's small fry. . ."*

Which reminds me..."Weird" Al Yankovic has applied his parody genius to more than one Star Wars movie:

Probably best known is the one that quote comes from, The Saga Begins - (The Phantom Menace) - a fun parody of Don McLean's 70s hit "American Pie." Check out his music video. ;))

And don't forget Yoda, released all the way back in 1985 as a spoof on The Empire Strikes Back. It parodies the 1970 hit "Lola" by The Kinks.

But wait, there's more; "Weird" Al isn't the only one doing this: Star Wars Cantina by Mark Jonathan Davis covers some events from the original trilogy. It parodies Barry Manilow's 1978 "Copacabana."

On to another question:

...The midi-chlorians, however. (Incidentally, what did the rest of you think of that addition to the concept of the Force?)

I was disappointed. I prefer Owi-wan's original 'mystic' explanation. (Which is probably odd, since I tend to be a scientific person who doesn't mind technical explanations of how things work).

But all night, Aslan and the Moon gazed upon each other with joyful and unblinking eyes.

Posted : May 8, 2012 5:46 pm
wild rose
(@wild-rose)
Member Moderator Emeritus

Hooray for Star Wars :)
I heard a lot about them from my older siblings when I was growing up, but never watched any till I was around 16. I never read any of the books (and don't really plan too) but the movies are enjoyable. I watched them in chronological order (the newer ones before the older ones). I think I enjoyed the older ones more though. Sure they are maybe not as well visually, the CGI effects aren't so cool, but acting and story wise it is really superior. The newer ones were cool and I like them a lot, but I think Lucas sort of flopped with the story, there were a lot of things that just didn't make any sense and some things that were down right stupid. Is there anyone who agrees with me?
My favorite episodes are A New Hope and Return of the Jedi

always be humble and kind

Posted : May 10, 2012 3:13 am
Shadowlander
(@shadowlander)
NarniaWeb Guru

Ah, May of 1977. Has it really been that long?

Tell me about it! I was but a wee lad of 5 years when my sister took me to the theater to see Star Wars. I've been an avid space nut ever since. That wonderful opening with the text crawl and then the Corellian corvette fleeing from the Star Destroyer in one magnificent overhead pass is one of the most powerful scenes in movie history. It cannot be overstated how much of an impact Star Wars had on the movie-making/watching world. :D

Like gazer' I didn't much care for Empire Strikes Back when it first came out. At the time I felt it was depressing and I hated that it left me hanging. But in time I came to realize that it was truly the best of the whole series. Han and Leia's romance could have been sappy and maudlin, but Kershner directed the film in such a way that there was always rip currents of emotion on screen between the two, amplified by their constant bickering. ;))

I find the prequel trilogy to be something of a let down, especially Phantom Menace. But the whole series is still great. I can't wait to let my daughter watch it for the first time. :D

Kennel Keeper of Fenris Ulf

Posted : May 10, 2012 12:02 pm
Princess Anna
(@princess-anna)
NarniaWeb Junkie

Sorry it took me so long to get back in here! To be honest, I was hesitant to do so, because I knew the length of post I was facing typing up. :p

Therefore, if you don't mind, I'll break it up. Easier for me to type, and for you to read through. ;)) Starting off, I'll respond to things in my own opening post. (lame, right?) And then, I'll move on to responding to things you have said. Does that work? I hope so... :-s

How did you first learn of the saga?

My Dad. I know I said earlier (ten days ago, to be precise), that I don't remember a time without it. And that's true. But I also know it was Daddy who introduced me to the movies. That much is certain. (he's also to blame for my Trek obsession) What year it was, or what age I was... I know not. So, that I can't tell you. Sorry!

What characters do you love most, or love to hate?

Uhhh... it might be smarter to break this down a bit.

Original Trilogy- Luke, Leia, and Han. (though all the good guys are pretty cool)
Prequel Trilogy- Yoda and Padme. I think. It's been awhile since I saw them. ;))
Extended Universe- And only read this if you want to be utterly spoiled:

Spoiler
the Solo kids: Jaina, Jacen, and Anakin

Have you read any of the books?

Guess that last question answers that! :))
That would be a yes. I also own quite a few that I haven't read yet. (most of my Extended Universe collection, actually) Shall I name the ones I own? (read or not read?)

Seen the shows (like Clone Wars, which I haven't seen)

Nope, not to my knowledge!

Which film or book or game was your favourite?

Uh... ouch. Tough one. (why do I do this to myself?! :p )

If I had to guess...
film- Episode V (aka Empire Strikes Back); It has more of my fave scenes than the rest do. That said, I love them all. (but prefer the originals)
book- Crystal Star (have to look up the info on it for ya)
game- the podracing one? I don't know... I liked that other one I have too. I think it was called "Galactic Battlegrounds"? I also know there is one game that I would LOVE to have, but I don't think it'll happen, as we don't have Kinect. (I think that's what you need for it)

What do you think of all the changes Lucas keeps making when rereleasing them on dvd and blu-ray?

As I haven't seen the changes for myself, it's hard to say. All I know about is the one with Anakin at the end of Episode VI. And I only know of that, because of youtube and reading about it places.

I actually have a question... I know you can't get the dvds or blu-rays without having changes on them. and I want to update to those. (I love my VHS copies, but sometimes I want to be able to screencap and stuff. and you can't with those) Any suggestions on if I should, and if so... which release should I get? (especially since it seems Lucas gives us new ones all the time) And should I get each separate, or all six films in one package?

Are you going to see the films in 3D as they come out?

Unless someone drives me, probably not.

What about having visited the attractions like at... was it, Epcot? (some disney place)

I know I did! It was when I was in high school... my choir was part of a competition down in Orlando, and we got to spend some time in the parks. I remember that part being my favourite... going on the simulator ride. and sitting on the one thing outside/taking a picture on it (only to lose the pic in development). I forget what it was called, but it's the thing Luke, Leia, and the Stormtroopers rode on Endor.

...................
#:-s
Ok, I think that's all for now. See ya soon!

Topic starter Posted : May 14, 2012 12:28 pm
Shadowlander
(@shadowlander)
NarniaWeb Guru

I've read a few of the expanded universe books. My favorite character from those is Admiral Thrawn, hands down. My favorite game is an older one called X-Wing Alliance. It's one of the old space flight simulators and the player could opt to fly the various Rebel fighters like the X-Wing or A-Wing or fly in a Corellian light freighter for family missions. At the end of the game you could fly the Millenium Falcon at the Battle of Endor. It was throughly awesome and the finest SW game I've ever played. :D Then again, even from a very young age, Jedi kinda bored me. I always wanted to be an X-Wing pilot. I count Wedge Antilles as among my favorite characters in the movies. And yes I'll say it...Porkins too. Fat guys like me need fat guy role models, and Porkins is like my Star Wars avatar. B-)

Kennel Keeper of Fenris Ulf

Posted : May 14, 2012 3:50 pm
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