Reading the book of Daniel this morning, I read this tidbit and am wondering if Lewis got the idea of the Tisroc (May he live forever) from Daniel who spoke these words to Darius, king of the Medes:
Daniel 6:19-22
Then at break of day, the king arose and went in haste to the den of lions. When he came near to the den where Daniel was, he cried out in a tone of anguish and said to Daniel, “O Daniel, sergeant of the living God, had your God, whom you serve continually, been able to deliver you from the lions?” Then Daniel said to the king, O king, live forever! My God sent his angel and shut the lions’ mouths, and they have not hurt me, because I was found blameless before him; and also before you, O king I have done no wrong.
Join date: Feb. 19, 2004
My nickname emoji: 
...Let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity,...with instruction about ablutions, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. (Hebrews 6:1-2)
Topic starter
Posted : August 19, 2018 2:48 am
I think the sort of flowery language in Calormen is based on classical tales from ancient Babylon.... are they also in the Arabian Nights stories?
There, shining in the sunrise, larger than they had seen him before, shaking his mane (for it had apparently grown again) stood Aslan himself.
"...when a willing victim who had committed no treachery was killed in a traitor's stead, the Table would crack and Death itself would start working backwards."
Posted : August 19, 2018 4:00 am
I noticed that too. But I don't believe C.S. Lewis was specifically alluding to the book of Daniel. The reason that phrase appears there is because it was used in real life, possibly by multiple cultures.
For better or worse-for who knows what may unfold from a chrysalis?-hope was left behind.
-The God Beneath the Sea by Leon Garfield & Edward Blishen check out my new blog!
Posted : August 21, 2018 3:31 am
What I find interesting about comparing the two situations (Narnia and Daniel), is that in the Narnian tales, it seems as though it is ludicrous to hope the Tisroc lives forever. I don’t get that same sense in account from Daniel, where it seems more an affection Daniel has for the king.
Join date: Feb. 19, 2004
My nickname emoji:
...Let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity,...with instruction about ablutions, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. (Hebrews 6:1-2)
Topic starter
Posted : August 25, 2018 8:18 am
Well, Daniel and C.S. Lewis came from really different cultures. It's not surprising that one would find the other's greeting ridiculous.
For better or worse-for who knows what may unfold from a chrysalis?-hope was left behind.
-The God Beneath the Sea by Leon Garfield & Edward Blishen check out my new blog!
Posted : August 25, 2018 8:29 am
On the other hand, Lewis had a classical education and will have know about formal greetings of ancient cultures.
I believe that the greeting to the King really indicates a wish for long life and good health - it's Hyperbole (exaggeration for effect on literature ).
There, shining in the sunrise, larger than they had seen him before, shaking his mane (for it had apparently grown again) stood Aslan himself.
"...when a willing victim who had committed no treachery was killed in a traitor's stead, the Table would crack and Death itself would start working backwards."
Posted : August 25, 2018 10:13 pm
If I'm not mistaken, the Calormen language and culture are based on a flurry of Oriental civilizations, ranging from the Islamic Arab world to ancient Babylon, including among other things Indian and Persian cultures.
Posted : September 29, 2018 3:54 am
In Nesbit's The Story of the Amulet, a group of Edwardian children use a magical amulet to travel back in time and visit ancient Babylon. The Babylonian king is called the Nisrock and on addressing him his subjects say 'may you live forever'!
Posted : September 29, 2018 5:05 am
In the same story, if I recall correctly, they accidentally bring back the Queen of Babylon to modern London. Sound familiar? 
(Nesbit was one of Lewis' favorite authors.)
PM me to join the Search for the Seven Swords!
Co-founder of the newly restored Edmund Club!
Did I mention I have a YouTube Channel?: https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCeuUaOTFts5BQV3c-CPlo_g
Check out my site: https://madpoetscave.weebly.com
signature by aileth
Posted : January 28, 2019 11:57 am
Well, going even further off topic, in Nesbit's short story, The Aunt and Amabel, a girl goes on a train journey which teaches her some lessons. The way to the station is via a wardrobe (called something like Big Wardrobe in Spare Room). Yes, really!
Lewis wasn't claiming to have invented his ideas, but the way he used some familiar concepts was very interesting.
There, shining in the sunrise, larger than they had seen him before, shaking his mane (for it had apparently grown again) stood Aslan himself.
"...when a willing victim who had committed no treachery was killed in a traitor's stead, the Table would crack and Death itself would start working backwards."
Posted : April 18, 2019 10:46 am
YES! I've read that story! It was so weird! As soon as I saw the name of the train station, I was like WHAAA??....
PM me to join the Search for the Seven Swords!
Co-founder of the newly restored Edmund Club!
Did I mention I have a YouTube Channel?: https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCeuUaOTFts5BQV3c-CPlo_g
Check out my site: https://madpoetscave.weebly.com
signature by aileth
Posted : April 18, 2019 4:14 pm
In Calormene culture, it was a common thing to say "The Tisroc (may he live forever)." Now CS Lewis probably didn't mean that the Tisroc lived forever (because obviously he didn't, given that there are more than one). It was most likely that he used that expression as a way of saying "Oh, the Tisroc's really great!"
In Ancient Babylon and Persia, it was a common greeting for the king, "O King, Live Forever!" It was a way of saying, "O King, you're really great."
"And this is the marvel of marvels, that he called me beloved."
(Emeth, The Last Battle)
Posted : September 11, 2023 5:26 pm
I'd be fairly certain that the use of an honorific phrase after the Tisroc's title is designed to mimic the similar custom seen in the Eastern cultures and religions of which the Calormen are a thinly veiled reference to.
For example, it is traditional to accompany the name of the prophet Muhammad with the honorific phrase "peace be upon him" whenever it is spoken.
In fact there is an entire Wikipedia page on the use of honorific phrases in Islam, such is the prevalence of the custom:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_honorifics
Posted : September 11, 2023 5:47 pm
Forum Statistics
31
Forums
4,936
Topics
353.6 K
Posts
80
Online
2,223
Members
Latest Post: Yum or Yuck Our newest member: BraadSher Recent Posts Unread Posts
