I guess it's possible that Pauline Baynes didn't want to bother with making in changes in the illustrations, even when the kids do age in the later stories.

I noticed this sketch that’s included on a color map the artist did (it’s included at the end of some editions of the books). As you can see, Eustace and Jill are noticeably shorter than Tirian (they might not be full-grown but I’d expect them to be closer to his height) and look overall about the same as in the SC illustrations (and in Eustace’s case, also like in the VDT ones). 

Also, as you can see, it’s dated 1971, after the official timeline was released. 

Posted by: @nicemice2023

I noticed this sketch that’s included on a color map the artist did (it’s included at the end of some editions of the books). As you can see, Eustace and Jill are noticeably shorter than Tirian (they might not be full-grown but I’d expect them to be closer to his height) and look overall about the same as in the SC illustrations (and in Eustace’s case, also like in the VDT ones). 

Also, as you can see, it’s dated 1971, after the official timeline was released. 

 IMG_9977.jpeg

That's interesting — I think I have seen that map somewhere, although it's not in any of the copies of the books I've owned over the years (three different sets, as far as I remember!).

However, as far as I can tell, the "official timeline" wasn't released before 1971. It was first published in Past Watchful Dragons by Walter Hooper, who says in that book that Lewis gave the timeline to him (which must have happened in 1963, as Hooper and Lewis only met in person during the last several months of Lewis's life, although they had corresponded by post for some time before that).

The publication date of PWD (I have it here) is 1979. Some of the material in it was originally published in a collection of essays by various authors called Imagination and the Spirit. That book was published in 1971, by Eerdmans Publishing Co. in Michigan, but I don't know if the Narnia timeline was included in this first version, as I haven't seen it.

Even if if was, that makes 1971 the absolute first date that the timeline was made public. Unless Pauline Baynes happened to have read this collection of essays in that same year (which may not have been published in the UK at all — books didn't spread around the world nearly as fast then as they can now), and the timeline was included in it and she took note of how old Jill and Eustace are supposed to be in the last book, there's no way she could have been aware of their "official" ages even at the time she drew that particular illustration.

As for Eustace and Jill being "noticeably shorter" than Tirian in that picture, it could also simply be that at age 15 or 16, they hadn't finished growing yet (Jill could be naturally short — I, as a girl myself, didn't grow any taller after the age of 12! — and Eustace might not have put on a final growth spurt yet), while Tirian may just happen to be tall. I don't think we're told how old he is at the time of LB (his birth year isn't in the timeline), but I get the impression from the story that he is already fully an adult, not a teenager like Caspian is in PC and VDT. We do know, from their reunion in Aslan's country, that Tirian's father, King Erlian, was a "grey-headed warrior" in his later years but "young and merry" when Tirian was a little boy, so I would guess from that detail that Tirian must be in his early 30s at least.

But all this is just speculation, and really, the very occasional discrepancies between the illustrations and the stories don't bother me. Pauline Baynes (is there some reason for referring to her rather obscurely as "the artist" when we all know who she is?) was a brilliant and well-known illustrator in her time, and her artwork for the Chronicles is almost as much part of Narnia as the actual stories, at least to those of us who grew up with the books rather than the screen adaptations. If anything, I'm more irritated (not seriously) by the fact that she always drew Lucy with dark hair when we're told more than once — including in LWW itself — that Lucy has golden hair!!  

It wouldn’t make much difference to me if Pauline Baynes didn’t get the ages of the children exactly right.  The Pevensies do look like children and the backgrounds are generally correct.  Pauline Baynes was quite a good artist who was meticulous about her work. I don’t think she made mistakes in drawing the characters very often.  The illustrations are attractive to children, who were her main audience. We are indeed fortunate to have the books with her artwork. 🙂

Posted by: @courtenay

Posted by: @nicemice2023

I noticed this sketch that’s included on a color map the artist did (it’s included at the end of some editions of the books). As you can see, Eustace and Jill are noticeably shorter than Tirian (they might not be full-grown but I’d expect them to be closer to his height) and look overall about the same as in the SC illustrations (and in Eustace’s case, also like in the VDT ones). 

Also, as you can see, it’s dated 1971, after the official timeline was released. 

 IMG_9977.jpeg

That's interesting — I think I have seen that map somewhere, although it's not in any of the copies of the books I've owned over the years (three different sets, as far as I remember!).

However, as far as I can tell, the "official timeline" wasn't released before 1971. It was first published in Past Watchful Dragons by Walter Hooper, who says in that book that Lewis gave the timeline to him (which must have happened in 1963, as Hooper and Lewis only met in person during the last several months of Lewis's life, although they had corresponded by post for some time before that).

The publication date of PWD (I have it here) is 1979. Some of the material in it was originally published in a collection of essays by various authors called Imagination and the Spirit. That book was published in 1971, by Eerdmans Publishing Co. in Michigan, but I don't know if the Narnia timeline was included in this first version, as I haven't seen it.

Even if if was, that makes 1971 the absolute first date that the timeline was made public. Unless Pauline Baynes happened to have read this collection of essays in that same year (which may not have been published in the UK at all — books didn't spread around the world nearly as fast then as they can now), and the timeline was included in it and she took note of how old Jill and Eustace are supposed to be in the last book, there's no way she could have been aware of their "official" ages even at the time she drew that particular illustration.

Interesting. Okay, well that clears it up. Crazy the map was made the year the timeline was released.

As for Eustace and Jill being "noticeably shorter" than Tirian in that picture, it could also simply be that at age 15 or 16, they hadn't finished growing yet (Jill could be naturally short — I, as a girl myself, didn't grow any taller after the age of 12! — and Eustace might not have put on a final growth spurt yet), while Tirian may just happen to be tall

I thought about that which is why I mentioned they probably weren’t full grown, I don’t know if you saw that part. I didn’t expect them to be Tirian’s exact height, but maybe a bit closer.

. I don't think we're told how old he is at the time of LB (his birth year isn't in the timeline), but I get the impression from the story that he is already fully an adult, not a teenager like Caspian is in PC and VDT. We do know, from their reunion in Aslan's country, that Tirian's father, King Erlian, was a "grey-headed warrior" in his later years but "young and merry" when Tirian was a little boy, so I would guess from that detail that Tirian must be in his early 30s at least.

It actually says that he’s between 20 and 25. I remember reading TLB for the first time and when it mentioned him having a beard I was confused, since I thought only old guys had beards, lol.

But all this is just speculation, and really, the very occasional discrepancies between the illustrations and the stories don't bother me. Pauline Baynes (is there some reason for referring to her rather obscurely as "the artist" when we all know who she is?)

Sorry. I didn’t think she was very well-known outside of the Narnia series, or that all fans were even familiar with her name.

was a brilliant and well-known illustrator in her time, and her artwork for the Chronicles is almost as much part of Narnia as the actual stories, at least to those of us who grew up with the books rather than the screen adaptations. If anything, I'm more irritated (not seriously) by the fact that she always drew Lucy with dark hair when we're told more than once — including in LWW itself — that Lucy has golden hair!!  

Yeah, that’s always been very odd. People apparently choose to believe Edmund and Peter are blonde and brunette as the illustrations show (even though they’re never said to look like that), since there were conplaints about their hair color in the films, whereas most people were fine with Lucy being a brunette like in the illustrations, even though the text says otherwise. 

Yeah, it’s hard to imagine growing up with the series without experiencing the illustrations in some capacity (how many your edition has can vary), and I had when Lewis won an award for the first book, he told Baynes, “Isn’t it our award?” That obviously says a lot.

Posted by: @courtenay

As for Eustace and Jill being "noticeably shorter" than Tirian in that picture, it could also simply be that at age 15 or 16, they hadn't finished growing yet (Jill could be naturally short — I, as a girl myself, didn't grow any taller after the age of 12! — and Eustace might not have put on a final growth spurt yet), while Tirian may just happen to be tall.

That is true. It's most likely Jill would have stopped growing and Eustace was still growing. Tirian could be tall, and the book describes him with limbs being full of hard muscles. Eustace describes Jill as being small in the book as well.

I know how that is, because I've stopped growing when I was about 16, and I'm only 5'2.

Posted by: @courtenay

 If anything, I'm more irritated (not seriously) by the fact that she always drew Lucy with dark hair when we're told more than once — including in LWW itself — that Lucy has golden hair!!  

I know what you mean. Though it could be possible that Lucy started out with a light blond hair than it darkened to golden when she got older. I was a light blond when I was a little girl, then it darkened when I got older.

Posted by: @nicemice2023

It actually says that he’s between 20 and 25. I remember reading TLB for the first time and when it mentioned him having a beard I was confused, since I thought only old guys had beards, lol.

Oh, that's right. It does, though I think the book also says that Tirian's beard was still scanty. So obviously he didn't a very big beard.

@Jasmine You raise a lot of inconsistencies in the timeline that I never thought about years ago that I am now seeing while re-reading the books after over a decade. I thought Swanwhite was a ruler after the Pevensie's and you could be right about there possibly being two rulers of the same name. I haven't gotten to Last Battle yet in my Re-reading, but I do remember seeing the timeline as the year in our world being 1949 years after Silver Chair and I think i remember a line in the book about the war (WW2) already ended. So back then I trusted the timeline.

@jasmine_tarkheena  Poor Jill, if she was rather short in her teens, and having the surname Pole! (BBC had a taller girl playing her, and the bullies at school were teasing her about her name).  Short people have had 'opposite' nicknames in the past like Lanky and Stretch, but how awful if it was her actual name.

@daughterofthetar It is something. Anything is possible. You like to speculate what happen in between gaps of each book. If CS Lewis could have explore on it in depth, he could have.

@coracle That's true, they've used a taller girl to play Jill in the BBC adaptation of SC. Though I don't think CS Lewis gave any detail on what she was being bullied about, her name or her small size.

There's a few things that don't add up.

The timeline suggests that there were only 20 years between Tirian's grandfather building the outlaw towers, and the end. In that time, we need Erlian to take over, and age quite a bit (the text suggests he's younger looking early on when he feeds Jewel apples, but then is a gray headed and older later on)... and then for Tirian to take over for a bit, at least (the mention of him doing yearly inspections suggests he's been in charge for at least a few years). Even assuming Tirian's grandfather died immediately after building the towers, that's a lot to transpire in 20 years. (Along these lines, Tirian says that Rilian has been dead over 200 years, but the timeline suggests only 199 years since Rilian's rescue, and it seems unlikely that Rilian dies immediately after being rescued.)

Also, I don't know if anyone has ever noticed this, but constellations. We know that the constellations are essentially the same between LWW and PC, because of Lucy recognizing the Leopard and her other favorites. But we also know from Ramandu that constellations have changed over time. This doesn't make a lot of sense if the constellations were constant for nearly half of Narnia's history, unless the stars moved around a lot more closer to creation.