In all the conversation about Christmas, I find it puzzling when people refuse others to say "Merry Christmas." I understand that in public places, it's generally safer to say "Happy Holidays" if you're working there, because you don't know what religion the person is. However, if someone says "Merry Christmas" back, I've noticed some people get offended or defensive.
Another thing I've found interesting is an atheist friend of mine celebrating Christmas, stating it was her favourite holiday. I can't come across why she celebrates it, but really? It's confusing, and to some extent annoying that people would not acknowledge that Christmas means Christ's birth, but like celebrating the holiday for no apparent reason than to give gifts, celebrate food, and have family reunions...

There is really little to be confused about. Midwinter Festivals celebrating the rebirth of the Sun (the Solstice) have been around for thousands of years all over the world in many cultures. When Christianity was young, this festival was adopted by Christians to celebrate Christs birth. And many propose that it was to blend in with pagan festivities so they wouldn't be harassed or arrested. Though as much other "Pagan" imagery was "adopted" that may not be the entire reason.

That is why some Christian groups like Jehovah's Witnesses don't celebrate Christmas (or Easter for that matter). They see it as a Pagan celebration that does not coincide with the actual date of Jesus' birth.

I can see no real reason why anyone should begrudge the celebration of "Christmas" to others, regardless of their religious (or not) beliefs. Should Pagans begrudge Christians adopting the "Christmas" Tree (a Germanic Pagan tradition) or Mistletoe (a Celtic Pagan Tradition). I agree with Draugrin, "Christmas" Time is a time for all to celebrate .

I do think it's a bit silly though, for anyone to take offense at "Merry Christmas", from one individual to another.

GB

I'd be cool with it--Jesus celebrated Hannukah, why can't a Christian? I'm a child of Abraham by faith, after all.

Indeed, we're basically "extended family". I cannot recall anyone ever telling me "Happy Hannukah", but I wouldn't be offended if they did. Things being what they are is there any set rule against a Christian like you or I engaging in traditional Jewish holidays like Hannukah, Yom Kippur, Passover, or the like? Would they take offense to our being there?

You know Shadow, I'm not sure . I think more orthodox Jews might be taken aback that a Christian might want to celebrate Hannukah, they may even have restrictions. But I don't think more "liberal" Jews would be that fussed, in fact they would probably be pleased to have the participation of Christians as a recognition of their roots .

GB

I am personally offended that people are trying to keep us from saying "Merry Christmas" while still desiring to take the holiday off.

I understand I think. I like saying 'merry christmas' better cause that's what I grew up calling it. But if we meet people who get offended by it, wouldn't it be better to just say 'happy holidays'? I agree it's silly to be offened by it, but if someone truely is, the least I could do is not purposely offend them.
I don't know, just my thoughts.

I'd have to agree with TBG and Shadow for once. In London, during Eid-ut-Fitr (Sept 20th), the many people openly celebrating the end of Ramadan did not seem to mind being wished a Happy Eid, so why should anyone not want to wish people Happy Hannukah, or Merry Christmas either, now it is both those seasons?

That is why some Christian groups like Jehovah's Witnesses don't celebrate Christmas (or Easter for that matter). They see it as a Pagan celebration that does not coincide with the actual date of Jesus' birth.

I heard something about that whilst visiting Westminster Abbey. Apparently Oliver Cromwell, who ransacked the place, to melt down what pre Civil War Crown Jewels there were, and who turned the Coronation Chair into public seating, also banned the celebration of Christmas for the duration of the Republic, until Charles II's restoration. Although to this day there is a commemoration of Oliver Cromwell in Westminster Abbey, the guide did point out that it was principally due to his abolition of Christmas and other festivities that made him so unpopular that he was disinterred and his body hacked to bits.

And yet, unlike the leaders of countries that allow Christmas decorations in some places, such as atheistic China, or secular republics like France, Oliver Cromwell was no atheist. Wasn't he one of those God-fearing Puritans, some of whom went across 'the pond' in the Mayflower? The ones that we have to thank for Thanksgiving? One of the Christmas conundrums that puzzle me as much as the chestnuts.

No, I've no reason to object to a Merry Christmas, but all the same, would you agree there is something surreal about celebrating Mid-Winter customs in the middle of Mid-Summer?

Those fairy-tale Wintry Dickensian scenes seem to have vanished from the Christmas cards at the Surreally Hot Supermarket Down Below. But without a variety of the religious scenes that I remember from days gone by, the cards available for purchase don't look anything much at all.

EDIT: What can be done to reclaim Christmas for Christ?

Okay, "Merry Christmas" vs "Happy Holidays"...

1. I can see someone saying "Happy holidays" by not trying to offend anyone, since people celebrate more than one holiday during that month, usually Christmas or Hanukkah. You never know what people are celebrating without really knowing them. But Messianic Jews celebrate both.
2. However, I really see "happy holidays" as a secular alternative to "Merry Christmas" or "Happy Hanukkah." This country [USA], and most of the Western world, wants to get away from any public display of religion. They want to make religion a private matter, as if it makes no sense in public or as if the public arena can function without religion. Wrong. And why Christianity usually takes the fall, I don't know. Amendment #1: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." Today, people misread "no law respecting an establishment of religion" as freedom from religion. But when any government institution makes any ruling about religion, they have violated this amendment. The public square is constantly "prohibiting the free exercise thereof." They say not only can you [general] not force your religion on others, you can't practice it yourself. What's another part of this amendment? "[O]r abridging the freedom of speech." When people say you can't say "Merry Christmas" in public, they're abridging your freedom of speech.
3. Confession: I heard the 50s [60s?] song "Happy holidays!" in a home goods store one year. And sitting in a rocking chair listening to that song, I became jealous. Nostalgia for the old days overwhelmed me. I thought, why didn't I grow up then?
4. I've never celebrated Hanukkah or even a Shabbat, but in 2004, I celebrated Rosh Hashanah with Messianic Jews. I loved it! I like Jewish food: matzo balls, potato latkes, challah bread. Yummy! And Jewish music...

EDIT
"Holiday" = holy day...
/EDIT

Have you ever thought how much Santa is like Jesus? Think about it.
1. What is Christmas all about now? Santa! All year people prepare for Santa. Are they preparing for Christ's return? What's Advent about? Preparing for the birth of Christ. So this Christmas, are you preparing for the Second Advent, the return of Christ?
2. All year, elves--Santa's helpers--prepare for his arrival on Christmas Eve. Their whole workload and attitude are geared toward that one day. What about us? Are we preparing ourselves and others for Christ's return? Is our whole focus on that? Are we really Jesus' helpers? Or are we working for ourselves?
3. What does Santa bring with him? Presents! What will Jesus bring when He returns? "For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works" [Matt 16]. "And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be" [Rev 22].
4. Santa has a naughty and nice list. So does Jesus... Which list are you in?

Just something to think about, folks.

wagga: I think the Puritans' [Pilgrims'] voyages across the sea were 1620 and 1630-42, during the reigns of James 1 and Charles 1. Didn't Cromwell come later than that, c.1650? Christmas wasn't celebrated among Christians as it is now. I don't think it really came into vogue until the 19th century, partly because of its pagan origins. Christians usually emphasized Easter. As this Wikipedia article points out, most Puritans didn't celebrate Christmas because they associated it with Catholicism and popery.

Following the Protestant Reformation, groups such as the Puritans strongly condemned the celebration of Christmas, considering it a Catholic invention and the "trappings of popery" or the "rags of the Beast." The Catholic Church responded by promoting the festival in a more religiously oriented form. King Charles I of England directed his noblemen and gentry to return to their landed estates in midwinter to keep up their old style Christmas generosity. Following the Parliamentarian victory over Charles I during the English Civil War, England's Puritan rulers banned Christmas in 1647. Protests followed as pro-Christmas rioting broke out in several cities and for weeks Canterbury was controlled by the rioters, who decorated doorways with holly and shouted royalist slogans. The book, The Vindication of Christmas (London, 1652), argued against the Puritans, and makes note of Old English Christmas traditions, dinner, roast apples on the fire, card playing, dances with “plow-boys” and “maidservants”, and carol singing. The Restoration of King Charles II in 1660 ended the ban, but many clergymen still disapproved of Christmas celebration. In Scotland, the Presbyterian Church of Scotland also discouraged observance of Christmas. James VI commanded its celebration in 1618, however attendance at church was scant.

In Colonial America, the Puritans of New England shared radical Protestant disapproval of Christmas. Celebration was outlawed in Boston from 1659 to 1681. The ban by the Pilgrims was revoked in 1681 by English governor Sir Edmund Andros, however it wasn't until the mid 1800's that celebrating Christmas became fashionable in the Boston region.

Pattertwigs Pal, commentaries can be wrong. A prime example is Job 41 with the descriptions of the Behemoth. Commentaries suggest it was an elephant or a large hippo. Have you seen the tail of an elephant or a hippo? It is certainly not like a cedar tree as the Bible describes. In fact the only known animal that fits the description of a Behemoth is a brachiasaurus (or bronosaurus). That is another reason why God didn't use evolution to create the world. If God used 65 million years to go between dinosaurs and man, how do humans know about them? I'll say more on that later.

That passage says the Behemoth ate grass like an ox. Sauropods (the infraorder that Brachiosaurus is a member of) didn't eat grass, they were tree-browsers. By the time the grass eaters showed up, most of the sauropods had disappeared from the fossil record. Also, contrary to the sauropods don't have belly buttons since they came from eggs. (The verse mentions strength in the navel of his belly.)

Job also mentions the mysterious "Leviathan." It's described as being a fire breathing reptile. (Bet you didn't know Eustace was in the Bible, eh? ) Last I checked there weren't any fire breathing dinosaurs, either.

I guess these things are what make it hard for me to think that dinosaurs were mentioned in the Bible.

I couldn't resist throwing my 2cents in there.

Edit: Merry/Happy Christmas/Holidays. I honestly don't understand the hullabaloo that is going on. People are freaking out saying that you'll get put in jail if you say Merry Christmas, etc. *sigh* I don't know what the big deal about saying Happy Holidays instead is, especially in businesses. I don't celebrate Hanukah or Kwanzaa, but if other people do that's their right. Christmas isn't the only holiday in December. Also, if people don't want to say Merry Christmas because they're anti-religious, that's fine. However, they shouldn't get offended by other people saying Merry Christmas.

TL;DR: Say it how you want and don't yell at someone who says it differently.

220CT:
Amendment #1: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." Today, people misread "no law respecting an establishment of religion" as freedom from religion. But when any government institution makes any ruling about religion, they have violated this amendment. The public square is constantly "prohibiting the free exercise thereof." They say not only can you [general] not force your religion on others, you can't practice it yourself. What's another part of this amendment? "[O]r abridging the freedom of speech." When people say you can't say "Merry Christmas" in public, they're abridging your freedom of speech.

Actually "respecting an establishment of religion" does indeed guarantee freedom from State Sponsored Religion, i.e. any particular religion is not to be promoted by the Government, and this applies to Government Property...NOT to Public Spaces.

Therefore A Nativity Scene is not appropriate on Government Property. But there is no LAW preventing Nativity Scenes in "The Public Square" nor on Private Property. I think you are conflating the Government with "The Public Square".

Consequently, your statement that "you can't practice it yourself" is a misapprehension. Likewise, your other statement "When people say you can't say "Merry Christmas" in public, they're abridging your freedom of speech." is also untrue. There is no blanket ban, Legal or otherwise, on saying Merry Christmas in public., therefore there is no abridging of your freedom of speech.

And, by the way, Santa's Elves are Pagan .

Wagga:
EDIT: What can be done to reclaim Christmas for Christ?

I'm not sure that anything needs to be done. Everyone knows the basis for Christmas is Christ already . But if people think this is a Real problem, they could push for changing the date of Christ's birthday back to a more likely one that isn't associated with the Winter Solstice Celebrations of other religions. They could advocate for Christians to stop celebrating with Christmas Trees, Mistletoe, Holly and Ivy, Santa's Elves, etc. . If it's the Commercialism that is most bothersome, then one could advocate against Commerce.

Now I'm only being partly facetious with this suggestion. I don't have a problem with blended Traditions myself. And I think that Christians promote Christmas and Christ best when they advocate for the ideals of Peace, Love, and Goodwill to all Man-(and Woman)-kind .

Peace and Long Life
Gandalf's Beard

They say not only can you [general] not force your religion on others, you can't practice it yourself.

I don't think this is necessarily true. No one is saying that people shouldn't practice their religions. At the most, I think non-religious people get uncomfortable when they find themselves in proximity to religious activity of any kind, and that can sometimes take the form of an indignant reactionary response where they invoke Amendment 1.

I do agree with you on the "freedom from religion" misread of that Amendment. People don't realize that when they invoke it, the person they are invoking it against has the same right given by the same Amendment.

People just get too silly about this kind of thing. If someone finds the 1st Amendment so important that they feel the need to use it to protest every public display of religion they find, they should respect it enough to grant it to those practicing the religion.

But if people think this is a Real problem, they could push for changing the date of Christ's birthday back to a more likely one that isn't associated with the Winter Solstice Celebrations of other religions. They could advocate for Christians to stop celebrating with Christmas Trees, Mistletoe, Holly and Ivy, Santa's Elves, etc.

I'm still a little surprised to find people who don't know about this. Many of the "traditional" American Christmas practices are actually holdovers from Norse/Germanic tradition, which makes sense considering the high number of Eastern European immigrants in the formative years of the nation.

Someone mentioned a few posts back that the blending of traditions occurred so Christians could blend in and avoid persecution. It was actually the other way around. The early Christian missionaries to post-Roman France/England/Scandinavia purposefully mixed the Pagan holy days with Christian teachings in order to make Christianity more palatable to the native inhabitants. I'm not calling it conspiracy or anything sinister of that nature, it's just what they did. They adapted the holidays and the gods, some of which became demons and some of which became saints. St. Brigit, for instance, was a very popular goddess of hearth, plenty, and smithcraft, and now she is considered Christ's godmother, among other things! Easter was originally associated with the return of spring, prosperity and new life, which made it an easy canvas for the celebration of the Resurrection. People could certainly push for changing the dates and celebrations, like GB said, but I don't think it would go over very well!

Draugrin:
Someone mentioned a few posts back that the blending of traditions occurred so Christians could blend in and avoid persecution. It was actually the other way around. The early Christian missionaries to post-Roman France/England/Scandinavia purposefully mixed the Pagan holy days with Christian teachings in order to make Christianity more palatable to the native inhabitants.

I quite agree . That's why I wrote this "a few posts back":

GB:
Midwinter Festivals celebrating the rebirth of the Sun (the Solstice) have been around for thousands of years all over the world in many cultures. When Christianity was young, this festival was adopted by Christians to celebrate Christs birth. And many propose that it was to blend in with pagan festivities so they wouldn't be harassed or arrested. Though as much other "Pagan" imagery was "adopted" that may not be the entire reason.

So to start, probably moving the date of the celebration of Christ's birth (and possibly adopting some of the language and symbolism of the Mithra religion) had a lot to do with avoiding persecution by Roman authorities.