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fantasia
(@fantasia)
Member Admin

Well ironically Jo, I have arrived in here because my mom got a copy of The Warden and the Wolf King for her Kindle a couple days ago. I don't know if she's read it yet or not. I lent her my copy of A Wrinkle in Time which she hadn't ever read before but has heard Ara and I babbling about for years... so she's going through that currently. At any rate, that reminded me that I STILL hadn't read Monster in the Hallows. I had tried a while back to start over to refresh my memory, but the beginning of Dark Sea of Darkness is painfully slow so I gave up. :P At any rate, since I had to sit in a doctors office for three hours this morning, and my husband was watching my kiddo the rest of the afternoon, I have now read Monster... the first book I've read since my son was born. :D :D :D I have not gotten a copy of Wolf King yet, but I hope to soon. Hopefully it won't take me two years to read. :))

Oh, and stwin, I'm so stoked you're reading Pern. I own the two trilogies, though I definitely prefer the Harper Hall trilogy. The first two books in that trilogy I've read over and over again. I've read Moreta

Spoiler
, it's quite sad if I remember correctly
but the rest of the series was getting too sci-fi for me and so it kind of lost me along the way.

Posted : July 25, 2014 12:30 pm
shastastwin
(@shastastwin)
Member Moderator Emeritus

Jo, I actually just read the first Paddington book not too long ago in anticipation of the movie. I'm excited to see it onscreen.

Hooray for you trying out some Bradbury. I'm actually listening to some dramatizations of his stories, a collection called Bradbury 13, which were produced for radio and are all available to listen on YouTube. :) You don't get as much of the lyrical narration this way, but they are superb radio dramas, mostly in the psychological or thriller vein like the old Suspense radio shows.

I must get my hands on these Wingfeather books you all have been raving about for years. I keep looking at McKay and having no luck. Perhaps I shall ask for them for my birthday next month. ;)

FK, it's very funny to me how much my taste in Pern differs from so many of the die-hard fans I know. I enjoyed the Harper Hall books in almost exact opposition to the majority: Dragondrums was by far my favorite
of the three, then Dragonsong and Dragonsinger, which I felt didn't develop much of anything as deeply as they ought, especially 'singer. I wanted to get more of Menolly's life in the Hall than

Spoiler
just one week, and her first at that!
The White Dragon was probably my favorite of the original trilogy. Moreta is still just okay in my book, but I've not been able to read it as much lately, and so I feel a bit stuck in it. It is a bit of a downer because of the main plot device, but I think my reading it while listening to Stephen King's The Stand at work hasn't helped my impression of it, as they both
Spoiler
feature a pandemic plague.

"All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a Thousand Enemies. And when they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you..."
Inexhaustible Inspiration

6689 posts from forum 1.0

Posted : July 25, 2014 12:51 pm
johobbit
(@jo)
SO mod; WC captain Moderator

Very cool that your mom is reading A Wrinkle in Time for the first time, fantasia! And that she now has Warden on her Kindle!

As for Wingfeather, I really should take time for re-read of the first three before I get into Warden. ;;)

Yes, do get your hands on Wingfeather, st!

Wanting to mention I have been meaning to read Pern for years now and somehow it has just always got shoved (not purposefully) down my To-Read list. However, knowing fantasia highly recommends it, and shastastwin is reading it, it's now high up there again. ;)) I don't know anything about the series (except that it's about dragons), so am eager to start. Where do I begin, guys? The original trilogy? Which is what, 'cause I'm getting confused? :p Also, is there both a publication and chronological order? 8-} ;)) And finally, which will I prefer: Temeraire or Pern? ;)


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Posted : July 25, 2014 1:18 pm
shastastwin
(@shastastwin)
Member Moderator Emeritus

Yes, Jo, start with the original trilogy. It's Dragonflight, Dragonquest, and The White Dragon. There is a chronological order that differs from publication order, but mostly in that McCaffrey (and her son, later) goes into the history before the series of "Present Day" Pern, where the original trilogy, Harper Hall trilogy, and their sequels take place. :)

"All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a Thousand Enemies. And when they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you..."
Inexhaustible Inspiration

6689 posts from forum 1.0

Posted : July 25, 2014 1:38 pm
fantasia
(@fantasia)
Member Admin

I would GUESS that you will prefer Temeraire. It's a little more fleshed out than Pern.

I am going to take a liberty and compare Pern to Tolkien. The original trilogy kind of reads like the Lord of the Rings, the Harper Hall trilogy is closer to the Hobbit, and the other books fill in details like the Lost Tales and Silmarillion. (Though they certainly aren't written as well.) I suppose that's why I prefer the Harper Hall trilogy, they're for younger readers much like The Hobbit.

Posted : July 25, 2014 1:47 pm
Anonymous
(@anonymous)
Member

Biographies: I should read more. History is filled with great men and women; it wouldn’t exist without them. There would be no cities either. The land would lie undisturbed instead. I still think we should balance biographies with historical works on events and ideas. People make history but, simultaneously, events and ideas carry them to their destiny. What would George Washington have been without the French and Indian War and the American Revolution? He’d have probably remained a surveyor, whom few people would have ever heard of.

The Scarlet Pimpernel
I'm curious. What do you think that Percy, Marguerite, and the League would have done with themselves after the Revolution? I’m sure they would have found something to do to avoid ennui. I like to think of Marguerite as a French translator (poetry, plays). I can’t think of anything suitable for Percy though. I also wonder what they would have named their six children. :p

Still, how close to reality are Orczy’s Pimpernel novels (besides plots)? She puts English in the mouths of French citizens for our benefit, but could Percy and his followers speak French well enough to convince a Parisian guard? I doubt it. Disguises are one thing. Language and accent are another. :-s

Other authors
I’ve read a few Grace Livingston Hill (1865-1947) books. She's also melodramatic, but I still enjoy some of her stories. Lo Michael! is a favorite. Yet I don’t remember An Unwilling Guest, another favorite, being melodramatic. The writing, characters, and plot seemed almost modern.

Has anyone read anything by the Pulitzer Prize winning novelist William Allen White (1868-1944)? I saw a feature film about his daughter last night called Mary White (1977). She died in 1921 at age 17. :(

POLL: in children's literature, who is your favorite author and what's your favorite book?

Posted : July 26, 2014 8:29 am
waggawerewolf27
(@waggawerewolf27)
Member Hospitality Committee

Biographies: I should read more. History is filled with great men and women; it wouldn’t exist without them. There would be no cities either. The land would lie undisturbed instead. I still think we should balance biographies with historical works on events and ideas. People make history but, simultaneously, events and ideas carry them to their destiny. What would George Washington have been without the French and Indian War and the American Revolution? He’d have probably remained a surveyor, whom few people would have ever heard of.

Up to now I have stayed out of your remarks about biographies because a lot depends on who writes them and why. And I can appreciate why you'd dislike autobiographies as in some instances they are a bit self-serving. If Augustus wrote a list of his accomplishments, as in the Res Gestae, and in it claimed he ruled entirely because of his influence, and not because of his power, you might reflect that he also had won a civil war, and that he had all his chief supporters in key places, even marrying his daughter to one of them. So did he become Emperor of Rome because he was such a nice bloke? Or was it really because the influence Augustus enjoyed was because people knew better than to argue with the Roman army and his power over the Senate? I am merely saying that some of the claims you may find in autobiographies might be taken with a pinch of salt and a great deal of scepticism.

On the other hand, I have liked some biographical novels, such as Taylor Caldwell's Dear and Glorious Physician or Great Lion of God. And at one time I enjoyed the Trapp Family Singers very much indeed.

Now we are brought back to history. I've long been fascinated by the way France and UK have evolved as the nations we see today. Both have had multiple civil wars and peasant revolts, though the French Revolution was far more vicious and permanent in its effects than the establishment of Oliver Cromwell's Commonwealth. Both nations have executed their appointed kings at some time or other, and so republics were instigated, though the UK one didn't last much more than a decade. Just as the trio or quartet of restorations of the French monarchy, which might have satisfied your Scarlet Pimpernel were not destined to last. France remained turbulent for some time to come, despite Napoleon and his nephew, Napoleon III, who was defeated in the later 19th century by the Prussians.

It is interesting to find out why these countries became so different, yet there are so many similarities. Even in the series of historic novels I am currently reading. I am now up to The poisoned crown. This book is about the unfortunate reign of Louis X, nicknamed The Hutin (the quarrelsome) who Maurice Druon depicts as a highly unpleasant, foolish young man, under the thumb of his scheming uncle, Charles of Valois, who undid the reforms his strong father's middle class minister, Enguerrand Marigny, had tried to make in the years prior to 1314. When reading this novel, it is not hard to see the seeds already being sown for the whirlwind unleashed in 1789.

Still, how close to reality are Orczy’s Pimpernel novels (besides plots)? She puts English in the mouths of French citizens for our benefit, but could Percy and his followers speak French well enough to convince a Parisian guard? I doubt it. Disguises are one thing. Language and accent are another.

That again depends. I'm inclined to agree with you that language and accent could be giveaways despite clever disguises. But then I think England has had a greater insistence on its aspiring citizenry learning the French language as part of their education, than would be the case for French citizens learning English. France has had a love/hate relationship with English from way back.

Curiously, English resembles Old French more than it resembles the current French language, but due to English "short cuts" the pendulum is swinging back again. And you have to allow for writer's creativity as well. It isn't a disastrous mistake since someone of Sir Percy Blakeney's wealth & position may well have spent time in France before the Revolution even broke out. Or so Baroness Orczy might argue.

Posted : July 27, 2014 1:15 am
aileth
(@aileth)
Member Moderator

I'm back, Wagga, with a brief comment on Great House of Estraville. The quality was better than I expected, seeing it was nearly her last book. The characters did not experience the intense emotional agony that characterized some of her other books. It was more pastoral and laid back. There was a quest, of course, and a bit of a romance. The interesting thing about the quest was

Now my days are swifter than a post: they flee away ... my days are swifter than a weaver's shuttle

Posted : July 28, 2014 6:51 am
Anonymous
(@anonymous)
Member

wagga: I never mentioned autobiographies in my comments. :-s I consider them a completely different genre, one I prefer to biographies. Yes, some are self-serving and can contain lies, exaggerations, and faulty memories. But the desire to express ourselves in writing, of which autobiography is just a part, makes us truly human. I also love to hear people speak for themselves. This is why I support non-profits like the Afghan Women's Writing Project. :) http://awwproject.org/

I have no idea what Sir Percy's education and experiences consisted of re: France and the French language before the Revolution. One can only guess. He does like to ridicule French in front of Chauvelin, to egg him on. :p

This past weekend, my hunger to learn more about 18th-century history and literature led me to read Daily Life in 18th-century England and Just Jane, a bio-novel of Jane Austen. I've perused other books in the Daily Life series (Greenwood Press). This is definitely one of the better ones.

Posted : July 28, 2014 8:20 am
Meltintalle
(@mel)
Member Moderator

I am also smack in the middle of Live Like a Narnian by Joe Rigney—very good stuff—and an unabridged, non-modern edition of The Pilgrim's Progress: great stuff!

I enjoyed Live Like a Narnian as well. He has a bunch of interesting observations and comparisons that I don't remember anymore.

As for Pilgrim's Progress I have fond memories of working my way through my great grandmother's copy. I should read it again one of these days. :)

*debates adding Pern to her to-read pile, but it has grown enormously in recent weeks*

We have hands that fashion and heads that know,
But our hearts we lost - how long ago! -- G. K. Chesterton

Posted : July 28, 2014 1:50 pm
aileth
(@aileth)
Member Moderator

Pimpernel and Rosemary is set in WWII and deals with a descendant of Percy and Marguerite. I think the eldest son was Jack? *strives to recall any pertinent details and fails miserably* Haven't read it for years.

You have an author list? You read all of one author's books at a time? I haven't tried that before, but it sounds interesting.

That wasn't quite what I meant, but yes, I do something like that--rarely all an author's works at once, but sometimes a large chunk. It is interesting to compare various stages of an author's career over the years. I'll do that if I'm rereading--most of the time, I don't buy them close enough together to do that the first time. Every now and again I'll get a bunch of an author at once, and then read maybe a dozen at a time. (There are twelve lines in my book journal, so one page's worth)

I have a number of authors whose works I am trying to collect; the list contains all the known works by each author. When I find a "list" book I am very happy; if I buy a double unwittingly, not so much. Hence the list; it helps keep me on track.

Now my days are swifter than a post: they flee away ... my days are swifter than a weaver's shuttle

Posted : July 30, 2014 7:50 am
Anonymous
(@anonymous)
Member

aileth: I understand what you're saying. Thanks for the explanation. Yes, it's very interesting to read an author at different stages of his/her career! :)

I don't like Orczy's style because I consider it a little too sappy, but boy do I love her characters and plots! ;;) I'm a huge fan of Percy/Marguerite and he's the definitive hero! I've now read three novels: Scarlet Pimpernel, Elusive Pimpernel, and Eldorado. I plan to read more, but I discovered some excellent fan fiction last night and got sidetracked. Some stories are sappy or don't get the characters right. Others are magnificent. Check out "One" (Percy and Marguerite flirting at a ball after 20 years of marriage). I also discovered the fan blog "The Day Dream." In one article, the author defends Marguerite. It's a must read. :)

I finished A Tale of Two Cities yesterday in time for my library's summer reading program (which ends tomorrow). I published a blog article today on Dickens' biblical understanding of justice in the novel. Enjoy. :)

http://artsandculturereviews.wordpress. ... wo-cities/

Posted : July 30, 2014 9:56 am
aileth
(@aileth)
Member Moderator

I also discovered the fan blog "The Day Dream." In one article, the author defends Marguerite. It's a must read. :)

Yes, that was worthwhile. I love all the little asides. Now I'll have to read the rest of it--when I have spare time :) And reread all the Pimpernels. Oh dear!

You know, the thing I like the most about biographies is how they can catch you unawares. As in, I really didn't mean to read that book right now, I just picked it up to flip through it, and half an hour later I'm still reading. That's a good biography. They also introduce you to a lot of different areas. I won't tend to read a science textbook for the fun of it :p but I will read a biography of a scientist.

What I don't like in a biography is when someone claims a degree of intimacy with their subject, and then betrays that trust. A case in point; a biographer of the Queen, used her pet name, Lillibet, throughout the book. The author had never met the Queen, something implied by that usage, but I felt it was really out of place, particularly when she being ruthlessly critical. The biographer was entitled to her own opinion on the matter, whether I agreed with it or not; but I felt she could have been less familiar.

Or when the biographer misses the chance to tell a good story.... Mrs Howard Taylor, writing of her father-in-law, Hudson Taylor, told how they came across a tiger, and no one got hurt. That was all she wrote. Missed opportunity!

Now my days are swifter than a post: they flee away ... my days are swifter than a weaver's shuttle

Posted : July 31, 2014 9:08 am
Meltintalle
(@mel)
Member Moderator

Or when the biographer misses the chance to tell a good story.... Mrs Howard Taylor, writing of her father-in-law, Hudson Taylor, told how they came across a tiger, and no one got hurt. That was all she wrote. Missed opportunity!

I was reading Richer By India, an account of an American missionary family in India, a few months ago and two thirds of the way through she mentioned that she had been in charge of reorganizing the library. ...And that was pretty much all there was on the subject. It sounded like an epic project, too, so surely it could have merited a few more words.

The library was good to me this week: R. J. Larson's Judge and King; the Lewis and Clark journals; Zane Grey's 30,000 on the Hoof, and S. E. Grove's The Glass Sentence. The last one I picked up at random because it sounded interesting. And then it claims to be about cartographers, so we'll see how maps and some sort of grammar related knick-knack tie together in a fantasy setting.

I'm about half way through Judge. Right now I feel like the parts I didn't want rushed were rushed, and there's some stuff going on that feels more like it has to be this way to keep the plot flowing than it is that way because that's the way that world works. But the characters have been consistent so far and it has a gorgeous cover. :p

We have hands that fashion and heads that know,
But our hearts we lost - how long ago! -- G. K. Chesterton

Posted : July 31, 2014 3:55 pm
waggawerewolf27
(@waggawerewolf27)
Member Hospitality Committee

What I don't like in a biography is when someone claims a degree of intimacy with their subject, and then betrays that trust. A case in point; a biographer of the Queen, used her pet name, Lillibet, throughout the book. The author had never met the Queen, something implied by that usage, but I felt it was really out of place, particularly when she being ruthlessly critical. The biographer was entitled to her own opinion on the matter, whether I agreed with it or not; but I felt she could have been less familiar.

Yes, I agree, especially as you say the author has never even met the Queen, let alone know her well. And especially if the biography is not even authorised as official. If that is the case, what were the sources he/she used to write the book, let alone write down his/her opinion? Were these sources named in an accompanying bibliography? Or were they just hearsay and innuendo?

Biographies often are written when there is some controversy or other about the people being written about. That way the authors are guaranteed massive sales for their works. However, I also agree with you that just because you feel an author could be more respectful, doesn't mean he/she should merely write a hagiography without having an opinion of the subject of the biography.

There is a place though, for biographies, especially if they present both sides of a controversy so that the reader gets a balanced report of what happened. Sometimes a well-written & authorative biography can do much to rectify the impressions people have been getting from lazy reading of the news.

Following on from 2011, there has been an ongoing enquiry into phone hacking used by British publications, followed by associated trials. Now when I hear of some piece of news about, say, Kate Middleton and her husband, I can't help wondering about the oft-quoted "sources". I now would like to know how far some of those "sources" can be trusted. There have been at least two new biographies of Kate Middleton which were published last year, and none of these have confirmed as valid, any of the ruder sorts of comments and allegations made online about this lady, who, I thought, behaved with a lot of dignity and friendliness when she came here in April.

aileth, did you enjoy the Great House of Estraville? Thank you for the summary you left me. I think I did read that book and also one called The Horn of Merlyns. This was in a series called Contemporary novels, though even in 1959 when I probably read them, it didn't seem all that contemporary to me then. That was the trouble then, that much of the literature available for children to read was pre-World War II, even pre-World War I but was still seen as the sort of thing that would reflect baby boomers growing up during the Cold War.

Unlike Woods of Windri and Changeling of Monte Lucio, which being in a different time altogether, I found more enjoyable.

Posted : July 31, 2014 7:29 pm
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