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[Closed] Why doesn't the mist "devour" the Dawn Treader?

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Reepi
(@reepi)
NarniaWeb Nut

Because the Dawn Treader is magic, as blessed by Aslan!

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Posted : May 2, 2011 10:30 am
mm1991
(@mm1991)
NarniaWeb Junkie

The mist knew they were on their way to destroy it? They were trying to keep the Dawn Treader away from Dark island?

Just a guess.

"Today you are you, that is truer than true. There is no one alive who is youer than you!"
- Dr. Seuss

Posted : May 2, 2011 10:31 am
Anhun
(@anhun)
NarniaWeb Nut

The mist devours the row boats in one gulp, but not the Dawn Treader, because the Dawn Treader is too big. An exciting explanation? No. But it makes sense to me.

Posted : May 2, 2011 12:31 pm
GlimGlum
(@glimglum)
Member Moderator

The mist devours the row boats in one gulp, but not the Dawn Treader, because the Dawn Treader is too big. An exciting explanation? No. But it makes sense to me.

Actually, I think Anhun has hit upon it or come close to it. The real reason the Green Mist couldn't devour the Dawn Treader was because...it was too full from eating the previous souls and therefore just wasnt hungry enough. ;) :D

It didn't want to get a big bellyache and therefore turn into a PG-13 type greener, scarier mist. So all it could do was just float around and try to scare and intimidate the crew a bit.

That also explains the Sea Serpent: best it could do under the circumstances. B-) :-o

In a more serious aside, I still think they should have made use of the slave ship that is in the book and had the Dawn Treader pursue it while searching for the Lost Lords. Maybe when VDT is remade a hundred years from now... :)

Loyal2Tirian
There is definitely no "a" in definite.
The Mind earns by doing; the Heart earns by trying.

Posted : May 2, 2011 1:34 pm
wolfloversk
(@wolfloversk)
The Wandering, Wild & Welcoming Winged Wolf Hospitality Committee

Maybe when VDT is remade a hundred years from now... :)

Hopefully less than that, I'd prefer to be alive to watch it. /:) ;)

As for the mist... maybe its like Job's situation... where Satan could harm his family, and his possessions, but not him. So maybe Aslan allowed it to take the smaller boats, but not the DT b/c of who was on board... so it was only allowed to tempt them.

Actually the more I think about it, the more this movie sounds like Job (not exactly-obviously, but there are parallels)

"The mountains are calling and I must go, and I will work on while I can, studying incessantly." -John Muir
"Be cunning, and full of tricks, and your people will never be destroyed." -Richard Adams, Watership Down

Posted : May 2, 2011 2:35 pm
Glumpuddle
(@gp)
News Poster, Podcast Producer

Bottom line: Even if we all put are heads together and put every line under a microscope and come up with a plausible theory about a possible reason the mist didn't "devour" the DT, it's still poor story-telling. Not enough information is given about the mist, and it's the backbone of the entire story.

By the way, trying to explain away a plot hole is about as much of a waste of time as trying to find one also...

No one's trying to find plot holes. Whenever I watched the movie, I got confused about what was going on. That's one of the big reasons it's difficult to get emotionally invested in the story.

The mist knew they were on their way to destroy it? They were trying to keep the Dawn Treader away from Dark island?

Just a guess.

Guessing is all we can do, sadly.

If the mist "devoured" them early in the voyage, the crew would be trapped there without all the swords. They would be unable to destroy it.

But of course the crew on the Dawn Treader, while fearing what Dark Island may contain, was never in fear of being devoured itself.. hence why they weren't devoured.

Why were they not afraid of being devoured? They see evil green smoke devouring ships and their bright idea is to sail right towards it? Wouldn't they be concerned about the mist devouring their ship too? The same question applies to the lords, by the way.

Question to you: If we asked the screenwriters about this, do you you think this is the explanation they would give?

after all, this is fantasy. There has to be some suspension of disbelief.

This isn't about not believing something. This about being confused about what is going on. I can't decide if I can "accept" the mist until I understand what it does and why.


YouTube.com/gpuddle | Twitter.com/glumpuddle

Topic starter Posted : May 2, 2011 2:36 pm
mm1991
(@mm1991)
NarniaWeb Junkie

The mist.....creates evil? And fear?

And it does it because....it's evil? It wants to take over the world?

Oh, but of course, except for the Dawn Treader and all aboard. Obviously. :p

"Today you are you, that is truer than true. There is no one alive who is youer than you!"
- Dr. Seuss

Posted : May 2, 2011 3:25 pm
CorazonBandido55
(@corazonbandido55)
NarniaWeb Nut

GP, i guess the reason I get the impression that you are nitpicking the movie to death is because you claim that movies should be subtle and not spell things out to you - yet you can't accept that the added green mist plot has elements that are only hinted at, instead of saying it right out.. plus the fact that you are constantly coming up with supposed plot holes months after the movie's release. Had you really thought it was a plot hole, wouldnt you have called it out immediately after seeing the movie? Never seen any post about it until now.

BTW, it always seemed obvious to me that the X-factor that prevented the Dawn Treader crew (and the Lost Lords for that matter) from being devoured by the mist had everything to do with the mystical Narnian swords that they had in their possession. Lilliandil wouldn't have guided the crew to Dark Island if she knew they were going to be devoured. Neither would have Coriakin.

your fellow Telmarine

Posted : May 2, 2011 3:35 pm
narniapinoy
(@narniapinoy)
NarniaWeb Newbie

Simply bec. the crew and the major characters inside the ship doesn't have enough fear (Remember that they strongly believe in Aslan), for the Green Mist to devour them, that is why the green mist tempted each character along the way so that they will loose faith and then the green mist can easily get them.

I think if you really don't like the movie, there's no point of understanding, you'll keep seeing the wrong thing. I really like the movie btw.

Posted : May 2, 2011 3:43 pm
Shy Galadriel
(@shy-galadriel)
NarniaWeb Nut

I think that CorazonBandido "hast hit it". The mist not devouring the ship bugged me a tiny bit, but the presence of the swords explained the situation for me, so I dismissed the plot-hole. It actually does make the film more fun with the ship not being devoured; people go, "Why wasn't DT devoured?" "well, they had swords!" It actually makes sense... As badly as I disliked the whole sword plot, but oh well.

I dreamt that I dwelt in marble halls

<3 As you wish <3

Posted : May 2, 2011 4:29 pm
Clive Staples Sibelius
(@clive-staples-sibelius)
NarniaWeb Nut

They didn't have the swords when they went into Dark Island. Except Lord Rhoop, who held the last sword...which apparantly wasn't doing anything to ward off the mist. Argghhhhh!!!!!!! *tears out hair*

Must not think about this any more....

"Even in literature and art, no man who bothers about originality will ever be original: whereas if you simply try to tell the truth you will, nine times out of ten, become original without ever having noticed."- CS Lewis

Posted : May 2, 2011 5:29 pm
GlimGlum
(@glimglum)
Member Moderator

The sword idea has some merit because Eustace uses the last one to slice through the mist and Lord Bern says they were given to "protect" Narnia. They do have at least one sword on board from Narrowhaven to Ramandu's island.

Perhaps as they gathered more swords their protection grew stronger. Or maybe Aslan was just watching over them and limited the mist's capablities.

But ultimately it was the screenwriters who decided the mist should not devour the Dawn Treader because they didn't want it to. :) (Or they knew it was a major inconsistency and no one would figure it out until 4.5 months later.) :D ;)

Loyal2Tirian
There is definitely no "a" in definite.
The Mind earns by doing; the Heart earns by trying.

Posted : May 2, 2011 5:45 pm
Glumpuddle
(@gp)
News Poster, Podcast Producer

GP, i guess the reason I get the impression that you are nitpicking the movie to death is because you claim that movies should be subtle and not spell things out to you - yet you can't accept that the added green mist plot has elements that are only hinted at, instead of saying it right out..

I always push for subtlety regarding themes. ("This place has TEMPTED you!" *groan*) Important story points and character motivations should be clear (like the book). The VDT movie is the opposite in this area: Themes are spelled out, and the story is confusing.

I would have a huge problem if it was a total mystery why the White Witch wanted to capture/kill the Pevensies.

Had you really thought it was a plot hole, wouldnt you have called it out immediately after seeing the movie? Never seen any post about it until now.

I have mentioned it a few times in my videos. And I thought I had posted about it, but apparently not. The mist is confusing on a number of different levels. For most of the past few months, I have focused on its lack of motivation.

It's important to feel a movie before thinking about it. When I first saw VDT, I could not connect with it any any level. After reflection and multiple viewings, I now see a big reason for that was that the mist doesn't really make sense and isn't compelling.

I was actually going to say something similar to you. I have discussed this issue with a number of fans, but this is the first time I have ever seen it suggested that the crew was immune to being devoured because they were not afraid of being devoured. Question to you: If we asked the screenwriters about this, do you you think this is the explanation they would give?

BTW, it always seemed obvious to me that the X-factor that prevented the Dawn Treader crew (and the Lost Lords for that matter) from being devoured by the mist had everything to do with the mystical Narnian swords that they had in their possession.

This is a possibility. But then why didn't the mist devour the DT before it reached the Lone Islands? Either way, this is a crucial story point and it's not explained.

Like I said before, we can sit here and go "maybe it was this...or this...or possibly this...." but either way, it's poor story-telling.

Lilliandil wouldn't have guided the crew to Dark Island if she knew they were going to be devoured. Neither would have Coriakin.

Coriakin told the lords to keep going towards the mist even though he knew full well they didn't have all the swords. What was he expecting them to do?


YouTube.com/gpuddle | Twitter.com/glumpuddle

Topic starter Posted : May 2, 2011 6:18 pm
CorazonBandido55
(@corazonbandido55)
NarniaWeb Nut

Gp: If you ever mentioned the question of why the DT was never devoured in your videos then I was unaware of it.  I'm sure you've figured out that I am not your biggest fan, so I have refrained from watching your videos.  The mist was meant to be a mysterious force.. Otherwise the directors wouldnt have made Caspian make such comments as 'if we ever make it out of.. Whatever this is...' and it's constant reference to being called 'The Evil' by Lilliandil and Coriakin.  My explanation to the Dark Island was simply because you asked for it and what seemed obvious enough to me obviously wasnt for all of us.  I personally thought that the concept of the Dawn Treader crew not knowing what the mist was is fascinating!  It kind reminds me of The Neverending Story movie where Fantasia is being consumed by 'The Nothing' and although the viewer may have some idea of what is going on, the Fantasians to not - and I love that mysterious concept.. Maybe that's why I like the mist subplot so much.  

As far as the DT crew not having all 7 swords when encountering Dark Island, I don't think you need to be in possession of all 7 swords to have some sort of immunity to the mist.. I think the presence of one sword is enough to deter the mist from devouring you.  And as far as DT not being devoured by the Mist before the Lone Islands...well that is simple.  The mist's reach is just simply not that far...yet.  It's referenced in the movie several times where the Dark Island/Mist is a growing force... another fascinating concept to me.

your fellow Telmarine

Posted : May 2, 2011 7:57 pm
Glumpuddle
(@gp)
News Poster, Podcast Producer

 I personally thought that the concept of the Dawn Treader crew not knowing what the mist was is fascinating!

If they made a mystery out of it, it might be kind of cool. If they spent time building suspenseMaybe if Caspian or Edmund asked Bern "what is it? Where does it come from?" And Bern replied "no one knows. All we know is that it appears every so often and devours boats." Then, along the voyage, the characters would slowly get more clues about it. That would still be a totally different story than the book, but at least we might have something resembling emotional logic. I just can't connect with characters who don't ask obvious questions. They blindly accept things that don't make much sense. Bern basically says "yeah, there's a mist," and then we're off.

The film refusing to sit still for a few minutes and build suspense and anticipation is a huge problem, both as a stand-alone story and an adaptation.

As far as the DT crew not having all 7 swords when encountering Dark Island, I don't think you need to be in possession of all 7 swords to have some sort of immunity to the mist.. I think the presence of one sword is enough to deter the mist from devouring you.  And as far as DT not being devoured by the Mist before the Lone Islands...well that is simple.  The mist's reach is just simply not that far...yet.  It's referenced in the movie several times where the Dark Island/Mist is a growing force... another fascinating concept to me.

I will concede this point. :D Those are not unreasonable assumptions to make. But I don't think they should need to be assumptions. These are crucial plot points. They should be made clear.

I also still don't buy the seven swords in the first place. But I think I will start a new thread on that.

I'd be really interested in getting your answer to this question: Do you think that is the explanation the screenwriters would give if we asked them?

I really doubt it. On the commentary, they said their target audience was 5-year-olds. So I think they just didn't care if it made sense.


YouTube.com/gpuddle | Twitter.com/glumpuddle

Topic starter Posted : May 2, 2011 10:20 pm
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