Here are a few dumb decisions made by King Caspian:

1. Bringing Eustace to the Lone Islands.
2. Announcing that he is king after being captured.
3. Sleeping on the shore.

4. Not posting a watch!

5. Bringing Gael along into the Dark Island and letting her stay up on the deck and watch.

All these decisions made me laugh when I read about them. It makes me think that all the scriptwriters were up at 4 in morning writing this script and had no time to go back and change it. These careless decisions did not make sense and clearly brought out a much different Caspian from the last movie, (not as smart Caspian.)

no one's perfect. I know that I make bad decisions all the time. Caspian has flaws, just the same as he had in PC.
it didn't really bother me.
I just didn't see it as being awful. I don't know how else to say it. this movie is my favorite Narnia movie and my favorite movie of all time. I love the whole thing.

The problem is Movie!Caspian is too flawed. He spent all of PC acting like a spoiled brat with Peter and then apparently he left his brain in Narnia in VDT. He's not a king I would want to ever be in the position of having to follow into battle.

Here are a few dumb decisions made by King Caspian:

1. Bringing Eustace to the Lone Islands.
2. Announcing that he is king after being captured.
3. Sleeping on the shore.

4. Not posting a watch!

5. Bringing Gael along into the Dark Island and letting her stay up on the deck and watch.

All these decisions made me laugh when I read about them.

Well actually the way the film was set up, and the way Narnia was set up, they aren't really such bad mistakes. Why?

1. Bringing Eustace to the Lone Islands. GlumPuddle commented that in the film VDT "They are all complaining about Eustace being there, and Eustace wants to leave. Why would they bring him at all?" Because as Eustace makes clear, even in the movie, he wants to find the authorities, in particular, the British Consul, on the Lone Islands to complain about being kidnapped onto the Dawn Treader. Furthermore, even in the book, Eustace would do anything to 'get off this blasted boat' (VDT p.34). At that stage Eustace did not believe that even Caspian, let alone his cousins were the sovereigns of Narnia, let alone the Lone Islands.

Caspian has done a great job so far in the voyage. He likes Edmund and Lucy, and gives them more than their due honour when the Dawn Treader picks them out of the sea. When Edmund wants to organise a landing party, it is Drinian who comments that it is Caspian's job to do that, not Edmund's, however he used to be a King of Narnia. And so Caspian goes ahead with the landing party, since it wasn't a bad suggestion for a friend to make. He does give instructions for a back up from the ship. Caspian is wise not to argue with Edmund but to include him so as to make it look like a joint endeavour between allies. Edmund, in particular, and Caspian are the very two people who could very well become rivals in the expedition.

If he includes Edmund, Caspian has no reason to exclude either Lucy or even Eustace, forcing either or both to remain on board. Especially as it isn't Caspian who is the kidnapper Eustace says he is, and Lucy has just as much claim to leadership as has Edmund, though she is unlikely at this stage to assert this right.

Yes, unlike the book, Caspian does say the place looks suspicious, but just in case we forgot, hey, he is the authority on the island, not Gumpas. At least Caspian makes a point of seeing he and his allies are all armed, including Eustace, something that Book Caspian doesn't seem to do when they go ashore for a nice stroll on Felimath. And yes, as the book makes clear, the Lone Islands were suspicious even in the book, since sovereigns, in particular, Miraz, hadn't been there for some time.

2. Announcing that he is king after being captured. The audience needs to know this, rather than the reader who should have gleaned this beforehand. It does look a bit dumb since King Caspian doesn't say this in the book. But in the heat of fighting it is natural for it to slip out. Nobody should have been given that reception, especially the visiting King.

3. Sleeping on the shore. Sorry, I never thought about this much. Maybe Reepicheep was the lookout, since we didn't see him in the scene otherwise. But even if there was a lookout, what was the lookout to see? The Dufflepuds were invisible, after all. Even in the book, it was Lucy alone who found out about the Dufflepuds when she fell behind to tie a shoelace.

5. Bringing Gael along into the Dark Island and letting her stay up on the deck and watch.

Ahem, this is neither Caspian's fault nor his decision. He did well to include Rhince's stowaway daughter as part of the package deal, and to remember that Rhince's family predicament was the human motivation for persevering with the journey.

Rhince, I believe, is Gael's father, and so far, Rhince has been unable to make Gael stay behind with an aunt. If Gael won't stay with the aunt and insists on accompanying her father, then it is for her father to keep her with him, or as her legal guardian, to leave Gael with someone else as he considers best for her. I don't think that Rhince would accept leaving Gael with Lilliandil, an utter stranger, however good she might be, a point that Edmund does raise in the book. When Lucy takes Gael below and tells her to remain there until someone comes for her, that was a great character moment for Lucy, to show that she is learning to take responsibility for the welfare of a girl somewhat younger than herself.

Remember, that is what Edmund and Lucy didn't want to do themselves, that is to stay with an aunt when the rest of their family were missing.

I think taking Eustace to the Lone Islands showed that Caspian treated him with respect as a kinsman of Queen Lucy and King Edmund - not based on Eustace's own behaviour or words at that stage.

There are a few 'have a laugh' moments listed in this thread - all I can guess is that the scriptwriters didn't get the level right when writing for children - most children old enough to watch this would be smart enough to think of most of these points in the end!

Well actually the way the film was set up, and the way Narnia was set up, they aren't really such bad mistakes. Why?

1. Bringing Eustace to the Lone Islands. GlumPuddle commented that in the film VDT "They are all complaining about Eustace being there, and Eustace wants to leave. Why would they bring him at all?"

Caspian has done a great job so far in the voyage. He likes Edmund and Lucy, and gives them more than their due honour when the Dawn Treader picks them out of the sea.

Too much honor is not a good thing. Edmund and Lucy aren't the High King and Queen of Narnia. Giving someone more than their due honor by calling them things they are not cheapens the title that Peter and Susan were given by Aslan.

If he includes Edmund, Caspian has no reason to exclude either Lucy or even Eustace, forcing either or both to remain on board. Especially as it isn't Caspian who is the kidnapper Eustace says he is,

Again, too much honor is not a good thing. Just because someone is the King's cousin doesn't mean you should drag them along everywhere where their inexperience could harm. And despite Eustace's inexperience, Eustace actually displays more smarts than Caspian does on the island. I believe he says something like, "Why can't this wait until morning," when they are landing. He also says that they should head back now before Caspian enters the suspicious bell tower.

At least Caspian makes a point of seeing he and his allies are all armed, including Eustace.

Caspian could have handed Eustace an AK-47 and it wouldn't have made a difference. Eustace doesn't know how to use a knife or any sort of weapon. He doesn't even want to fight at that point in the movie...he's a pacifist, as he says later on.

The audience needs to know this, rather than the reader who should have gleaned this beforehand.

Which is why Caspian is referred to as King Caspian several times before this scene takes place.

But in the heat of fighting it is natural for it to slip out. Nobody should have been given that reception, especially the visiting King.

Except, they weren't fighting. Caspian had already been put in irons by slave traders, who were already breaking the law. What were the slave traders supposed to do, apologize and unlock Caspian so that he could arrest them all for slave trading?

But even if there was a lookout, what was the lookout to see? The Dufflepuds were invisible, after all.

Unless the lookout was deaf, he could have heard the Dufflepud's footsteps and voice. He also could have seen the footprints and Lucy mysteriously floating away.

Ahem, this is neither Caspian's fault nor his decision.

All right, I'll accept that. Rhince was the true idiot here.

He did well to include Rhince's stowaway daughter as part of the package deal, and to remember that Rhince's family predicament was the human motivation for persevering with the journey.

Here you're making it sound like it was Caspian's fault/decision. Bringing along a 7 year old girl into a battle with you for "human motivation" is stupidity.

I don't think that Rhince would accept leaving Gael with Lilliandil, an utter stranger, however good she might be.

-pictures Rhince thinking to himself-
Hmmm...I can either leave my daughter with a very nice female stranger who just gave us all food and guided us to Aslan's Table, or I can bring my daughter along with me into a Giant Green Cloud of Evil that contains our Darkest Dreams and our Worst Nightmares. Such a tough decision...

When Lucy takes Gael below and tells her to remain there until someone comes for her, that was a great character moment for Lucy, to show that she is learning to take responsibility for the welfare of a girl somewhat younger than herself.

Something that the girl's own father couldn't do.

Remember, that is what Edmund and Lucy didn't want to do themselves, that is to stay with an aunt when the rest of their family was missing.

Yeah, but Edmund and Lucy aren't 7 year old girls with no experience in deadly adventures.

1) Well the only think I can figure is that Caspian figured that Eustace would have gotten in the crew's way. There are lots of things that must be done on a ship, even if it's docked. And Eustace is not a person, who's presence would have been helpful. So perhaps he didn't trust Eustace enough to leave him on the boat. Secondly if they left him there, a lot of fans would be upset and angry, including myself, since it would still contradict the book. (I know some of you disagree, but I believe bringing him is the lesser of two evils.)

5) I doubt that they could have left Gael on Ramandu's Island, because they figured it would have been useless since she had already snuck on the boat once to be with her father. And her father had to be with the crew, since they'd need every able body they could get. As for leaving her on deck, a) they were distracted and probably didn't notice her, b) it wouldn't have made things any less scary. Lucy only brings her down to keep her away from the serpant, and that's the only time that bringing her below deck would have been remotely less dangerous.

The other three points I have no points against.

1) Well the only think I can figure is that Caspian figured that Eustace would have gotten in the crew's way. There are lots of things that must be done on a ship, even if it's docked.

I would have thought that Eustace would get much more in the way of the expedition than chores around the ship. On the expedition, he got them all kidnapped. On the boat, what could he have done? Thrown a tantrum? He is physically inferior to everyone on the boat and would probably just go down and sleep.

And Eustace is not a person, who's presence would have been helpful.

??? Eustace is a person.

I doubt that they could have left Gael on Ramandu's Island, because they figured it would have been useless since she had already snuck on the boat once to be with her father.

So because she disobeyed them once, there's no point in telling her to do something again because she'll just disobey them again? (One thing that bothered me in the film is that there's not even a hint by the crew members that what Gael did was wrong.)

So what could the crew do in such circumstances? Tie her to the mast and give her a dozen of the best? Keelhaul her? Maroon her on Dragon Island? Lock her in the scuppers? Remember that this is supposed to be a PG movie, that treating children this way was only done at the sort of boarding school C.S.Lewis attended as a child, and some post war orphanages, but is not done any more even in the Royal Navy, even as long ago as WW2. There would be real complaints about the movie should Gael be treated in such a manner.

Or do they do with Gael exactly what they had already done to the best of their ability to Edmund, Lucy and Eustace? Aren't the crew members supposed to be the good guys in this movie? They did the best they could with her by accepting her presence, feeding her and accommodating her more appropriately with Lucy.

By the way, Eustace the pacifist is Edmund's responsibility as much as Caspian's, something film Edmund remembers belatedly on Dragon Island, to his credit. Therefore where Edmund goes, so does Eustace. It isn't the crew's responsibility to keep Eustace entertained on board the ship.

Or do they do with Gael exactly what they had already done to the best of their ability to Edmund, Lucy and Eustace? Aren't the crew members supposed to be the good guys in this movie? They did the best they could with her by accepting her presence, feeding her and accommodating her more appropriately with Lucy.

But Edmund and Lucy are king and queen. They aren't unacquainted with peril. They are here to help Caspian -- and it just so happened that their rather useless cousin Eustace came along with them as well. But they couldn't have returned him to England, of course.

I don't believe it's the same with Gael. If the Dawn Treader was not very far away from the Lone Islands (say, within a day or two), then why did they not simply turn right around and return her to her aunt? (Imagine her aunt's horror at not being able to find her niece. ) It would definitely be an inconvenience to everyone on the ship, but I just don't see why it would make sense to take her along.

So what could the crew do in such circumstances? Tie her to the mast and give her a dozen of the best? Keelhaul her? Maroon her on Dragon Island? Lock her in the scuppers? Remember that this is supposed to be a PG movie.

Good grief, I never said she should get corporal punishment. (Although Reepicheep does say in the movie that men have been killed for things smaller than stealing oranges.) Something along Peter's "When are you going to learn to do as you're told" at the end of LWW would have been sufficient. Just a reminder that Gael wasn't following the rules. The way Lucy said, "Welcome aboard the Dawn Treader," it made Gael sound like she was an expected and respected guest, not an unwanted stowaway.

By the way, Eustace the pacifist is Edmund's responsibility as much as Caspian's, something film Edmund remembers belatedly on Dragon Island, to his credit. Therefore where Edmund goes, so does Eustace.

So instead of leaving him on the ship where he would be safe, they instead leave him outside the bell tower alone and unattended, where he causes them to get captured. Even if Edmund should stick to Eustace like glue, this still was not followed on the Lone Islands.

I still think Caspian including Eustace at the Lone Islands was him not *knowing* Eustace. Yes, Eustace is upset, but maybe Caspian thought that would be normal when being upended from all you've ever known and thrown into a new world. Surely, Caspian might think, Eustace only needs the opportunity and he will show himself to be *true* blood-kin of the Kings and Queens of Old. Lucy, I could see feeling kind-hearted enough to believe the same. And even Edmund, annoyed as he is with Eustace, would remember in the back of his mind how *he* had been his first time in Narnia, thinking that maybe including Eustace might help him become *better*. If wasn't the smartest idea, but thoughts of the heart aren't always logical.

However, taking Gael to Dark Island is inexcusable. Yes, they don't know Lilliandil well, but they trusted her enough to follow her direction and sail to the evil island. Trusting Gael with their appointed guide on an island with plenty of food makes a lot more sense than taking her to an island where dreams come true and where dwells evil greater than a witch. Seriously. Rhince should have requested Gael stay, and Caspian should have insisted.

He was supposed to be lookout, wasn't he? This is something even a pacifist person might be willing to do. Edmund, who clearly didn't want Eustace along, either, was the one to suggest it, and it was Caspian who saw that Eustace at least had a dagger. If film Edmund had really been in kingly mode he would have seen to it that Eustace did remain with him.

The trouble is with film Edmund is that at this stage Edmund still is rather full of his own adventures in Narnia in past episodes. Edmund doesn't yet see that his brother Peter used to take some responsibility towards what the remainder of the Pevensies did, and he doesn't see that in Narnia, Edmund has to be like Eustace's elder brother. And I might add that up until Eustace was dragonned, book Edmund hardly behaved any better, either, according to Eustace's diary, and even allowing for Eustace exaggerating.

Let us look at those adventures:

1. His initial inglorious entry to Narnia and then the battle at Beruna
2. His heroic behaviour at Anvard and in rescuing his sister Susan from Tashbaan. This is alluded to in the introduction to VDT (film).
3. His behaviour in Narnia when Caspian blew the horn. Remember Edmund's torch?

Since Eustace was clearly apart from the others who were sleeping on the beach, at Magician's Island, I certainly hope that he hadn't been the one to volunteer to be lookout. Because if he did, there is no wonder that the Dufflepuds found it easy to get Lucy away. Eustace not only went to sleep, he woke up after the situation had been resolved.

Good grief, I never said she should get corporal punishment. (Although Reepicheep does say in the movie that men have been killed for things smaller than stealing oranges.) Something along Peter's "When are you going to learn to do as you're told" at the end of LWW would have been sufficient. Just a reminder that Gael wasn't following the rules. The way Lucy said, "Welcome aboard the Dawn Treader," it made Gael sound like she was an expected and respected guest, not an unwanted stowaway.

In those days punishment was mainly of the short, sharp and physical variety, I have to admit. Cane first and ask questions later. And if you think disobedience was to be punished, then yes, she would have got corporal punisment. I got that for far less than running away, because I, too, had failed to do as I was told.

By the way, if you want to read a good juvenile novel about the evacuations from London, you might read a book called Goodnight, Mr Tom by Michelle Magorian. I understand that it wasn't unusual for children billeted in the country to make their own way back so as to be with their own parents in World War II. I think only those with the hardest hearts would have seen such behaviour as anything else than laudable. Therefore Gael might be seen in similar light.

I was responding to Minotaur's post when Lirenel also posted. Sorry, I don't see the Dawn Treader being able to get back easily to Narrowhaven, without losing their way. Don't forget they didn't have charts for this part of the ocean, they didn't know much and they didn't have the luxury of a radio phone such as most ships have, including Jessica Watson sailing around Cape Horn. Rhince had no other option but to take his daughter with him, and it was up to Caspian and Drinian to make the best of the situation.

It is good that Lucy woke up to her big sisterly responsibilities and looked out for Gael, whilst others were busy. There is nothing inexcusable in taking Gael to Dark Island. They had no other choice, really. And no, they should not have marooned Gael anywhere. Now that would really be unethical. As Harry Potter would say in DH (the book), parents should not leave their children unless they can't really help it.

So it's excusable to take small children into deadly danger for no good reason, when there is an entirely safe alternative that won't require any extra effort to pursue. Good to know. Don't think I'd ever want someone who thinks that babysitting any children.

There is nothing inexcusable in taking Gael to Dark Island. They had no other choice, really. And no, they should not have marooned Gael anywhere. Now that would really be unethical. As Harry Potter would say in DH (the book), parents should not leave their children unless they can't really help it.

Rhince, while a good sailor, is technically an addition to a fully equipped and competent crew. He didn't have to go to Dark Island, he could have stayed on Ramandu's Island with Gael. In fact, if you want to bring other books into it, Harry Potter in DH would have been all for that - it's what he told Lupin to do, stay with Tonks and Teddy. And look what happened when Lupin and Tonks decided otherwise.