@Col Klink  Keep in mind, a lot of the criticisms levelled at The Voyage of the Dawn Treader(2010) on Narniaweb, such as the dialogue being cheesy, the plot being full of holes, the actors' line deliveries (some of them anyway) being flat, were also the typical charges laid against the Star Wars prequels.

You could be right. But perhaps another reason for the criticism was that there was more scope for comparison between BBC Voyage of the Dawn Treader and Walden Voyage of the Dawn Treader. Neither BBC Prince Caspian nor Walden Prince Caspian featured that long procession throughout Miraz's Narnia at the end of the book, before all the Pevensies went home, and in my collection of DVD's BBC, PC is so short that if I blinked, I'd miss it, being combined with the longer VDT, featuring Samuel West as King Caspian. Whereas Walden PC is more filled out.

Yes, the Star Wars prequels might have incurred criticism in comparison with the three original Star Wars movies, but a fair amount of time had also elapsed before the prequels were produced. And by the time the remaining movies came out on film, I was beginning to be all over Star Wars movies, particularly after Carrie Fisher passed away. Did the Emperor Palpatine really need to be killed a second time?

To start with the first part of your question, I think it's worth being clear on some of the stats for VDT and the other Walden movies.

It's not just that there is a handful of NanriaWebbers who have set the prevailing opinion on these films - you can look at any of the user scores (nevermind critic scores) from any of the major review aggregation websites and see the same basic pattern - all three films score decidedly in the "average to ok" sort of range and VDT is consistently the lowest scoring of the bunch 

LWW (2005)

• IMDB - 6.9
• Metacritic - 7.5 (users)
• Metacritic - 75% (critics)
• Rotten Tomatoes - 75% (critics)
• Rotten Tomatoes - 61% (users)

PC (2008)

• IMDB - 6.5
• Metacritic - 6.7 (users)
• Metacritic - 62% (critics)
• Rotten Tomatoes - 66% (critics)
• Rotten Tomatoes - 73% (users)

VDT (2010)

• IMDB - 6.3
• Metacritic - 6.1 (users)
• Metacritic - 53% (critics)
• Rotten Tomatoes - 49% (critics)
• Rotten Tomatoes - 58% (users)

Therefore it does seem unlikely to me that the prevailing opinion on these films is going to ever change all that much, and even less likely that it would shift in Dawn Treader's favour.

As for the Star Wars Prequels, whilst I think there is still a general consensus that they are somewhat messy and incoherent films, I think the thing that people have come to appreciate (especially in light of some modern designed-by-committee blockbusters) is how much unique creative vision and imagination director George Lucas brought to the project, which does still shine through amongst all the sloppiness of the execution.

I really though don't think the same can ever be said for Michael Apted's direction... I think really the only shift in opinion I've seen is that people have a lot more sympathy for how badly the film turned out as a result of learning more about all the behind-the-scenes production troubles with he studio.

Maybe people will therefore become less harsh on it, but I just can't see it ever elevating itself to the status of "good" film.

Those of us old enough to have grown up on the book, the BBC serial, the radio dramas, and saw Walden movies tend to dislike VDT because of the changes to the story with the addition of the Green mist. 

My preview screening of VDT had the Walden Media big wig, Michael Flaherty present and his question literally was "What do you think glumPuddle will think?"

I had to tap dance around and give a politely vague answer. They cared enough to ask after the fact, but they didn't respond beforehand and that's why if I go back and watch it, I watch the entrance to Narnia, Eustace and Reep's showed fight, and the island at the end of the world and that's about it. Those parts are pretty much straight out of the book. That and the ship were the only parts most of us liked about the movie. 

So the book fans will never likely "like" or revise their opinions on the Walden movie. The BBC had far cheesier delivery of book lines, but they were book lines and they mattered because the story was intact and to some, that will always matter.

I've never watched Walden's VDT and still have zero desire to, but I'm certain the three Walden Narnia films, collectively or individually, have never had the same level of cultural impact as the entire Star Wars franchise has had from the late 1970s onwards.

In the interests of full disclosure, I've never watched any of the Star Wars films and spin-offs either. But it's quite obviously a MUCH bigger "thing" than the Walden Narnia trilogy ever was or is or will be. So while VDT will probably always have some fans, I doubt there'll ever be a whole huge wave of new-generation viewers elevating it to classic status. From everything I've heard about it, the film simply isn't that good even as a story in its own right, let alone as a faithful adaptation of the book. 

I think the Dawn Treader movie could have been a much better film if the story adaptation had been improved. I find that some people who criticize the film have not been specific enough in what they believe is wrong with it.  And they don’t consider the better parts of the film such Will Poulter playing Eustace and the realistic portrayal of Eustace as the dragon. The water coming from the picture of the ship was quite real looking.

If people haven’t seen the movie at least once they shouldn’t criticize it either. Certainly there are many flaws in it, but I wouldn’t say the movie is all bad. Some of the scenes like the island of the Dufflepuds do have some interest so they are not actually boring even though they are not a perfect story adaptation. There would be a renaissance if a better Dawn Treader movie were made, but that may be many years in the future. Those who make a new film that is better will know that anything like the Green Mist should be left out.

@Courtenay I've never watched Walden's VDT and still have zero desire to, but I'm certain the three Walden Narnia films, collectively or individually, have never had the same level of cultural impact as the entire Star Wars franchise has had from the late 1970s onwards.

Yes, you are right about the Star Wars series. One of my three children was into Star Trek in a big way right through the recent Pandemic. The Star Wars fanatic's favourite character was Chewbacca the Wookiee, though it is her elder sister who watches all these spin-offs now.  Whilst the third was more into Manga. Whilst Hubby went along with whatever the children chose to watch, not being a reader by inclination. Though I'd read to all of them the Narnia stories, they'd listened to the BBC radio tapes & watched the BBC series, they only watched the Walden trilogy, VDT, in particular, because I dragged them off to see it, when it first was released in late 2010.

By then, the Harry Potter movies were still to be finished, though we all had enjoyed Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings 3 films before Walden's LWW was released in Christmas 2004. Though we went to see all the The Hobbit films, I don't think I bought the DVDs, nor did anyone ask me to do so. And when Walden's Silver Chair never materialised, I'd just about given up that any further films would ever be made, let alone on Netflix.  

Nonetheless, I still have an affection for VDT, when it was at least partly filmed in Australia, when I thought the settings for Aslan's Table was sensational, filmed in Queensland's Mount Tambourine, and when my husband and I visited Movie World at Coomera where the Dawn Treader was housed & on view during the Christmas Holidays in January 2011. Compared to the BBC boat, the Walden one was terrific, with a fascinating ship's bell. We got to walk on the actual deck, admiring the artistry in its assembly, and we were photographed standing by its detachable dragon's head. That was before the White Island (Whakaari) volcano erupted, off the coast of New Zealand on 9th December in 2019, when some tourists visiting the site, were killed, regrettably. That was where Walden had filmed the Dragon Island sequences in its VDT production, so that particular sequence will never be replicated on that site again, when I believe that the area was sold to a private concern. 

Thus, though I concede that Walden VDT had its faults, I think it will remain a curiosity, when though Netflix is producing Magician's Nephew it is yet to be seen if other Narnia books will be filmed, let alone getting as far in the series as VDT. 

I think audiences are getting dumber and more accepting of lazy and poor writing. It is evident in the popular franchise both in movie and tv. Things no longer have to make sense, it just has to do fan service. Narnia is no difference. There are people who enjoyed the books but have grown lazy and need to be spoon fed their stories in a visual medium and they will take it anyway they can get it. The Voyage of the Dawn Treader was a horrible adaptation of the story and I am not sure why anyone would want to subject themselves or their kids to it, especially since we have the books which are the pure and unblemished story and the reason people have fallen in love. A quick fix is never really satisfying, put the time in and enjoy the story as it was meant to be enjoyed. I am not opposed to film adaptations, there can be good ones, but the modern media does not seem to take any of this seriously and again are going for the cheap fan service thrills so someone gets excited when they see a.character they recognize, even if that character does not act as they were/are supposed to. Tolkien said it best “The canons of narrative in any medium cannot be wholly different; and the failure of poor films is often precisely in exaggeration, and in the intrusion of unwarranted matter owing to not perceiving where the core of the original lies.”

@waggawerewolf27 

May I correct that detail about White Island?  Nobody did any filming on it for VDT; some backgrounds were filmed from a boat. Walden at least showed good judgement in not taking cast, crew or equipment onto a live volcano island.  

As has been said, Star Wars continually has a fan base which is much bigger than that for the Walden Narnia films, whatever the quality of the picture is. 

The films will most likely get more viewings again when the Netflix Narnia comes out, but not to such an extent that VDT will soar in popularity. 

Thanks for the response, guys! I'd just like to clarify a couple of little things.

Posted by: @courtenay

I'm certain the three Walden Narnia films, collectively or individually, have never had the same level of cultural impact as the entire Star Wars franchise has had from the late 1970s onwards.

Posted by: @sir-cabbage

Star Wars continually has a fan base which is much bigger than that for the Walden Narnia films, whatever the quality of the picture is. 

FWIW, I was talking about a renaissance within the niche Narnia fan community, not the world at large. Also, FWIW, here are a couple of comments I recall reading on the first Narniaweb podcast episode after we'd all seen the movie. (I had to go hunt them down.) The first is from someone going by the moniker of LessThanGold. 

You know what's funny… I'm pretty sure most of you who don't like the VDT movie much are teenagers/adults, right? Well, I went to the movie with a youth group and later bumped into a some preteens I know. Their reactions? "It wasn't like the book, but an AWESOME movie!" Weren't bored a bit, apparently. The only thing that had them confused was Eustace's undragoning.

Looks like this movie is more for younger kids. (Admittedly, that sort of makes me cringe, since VDT should be for all ages, but there's my one cent.)

Someone called Roger replied

I agree with you. As an older adult I felt that the movie talked down to me. The green mist pointing out all the moral lessons really offended me. The movie is too simplistic. This movie was perfect for a youth leader trying to minister to young people. I am very glad that young people enjoyed the movie. Except for the fight sequences this should have been a "G" rated film. 

The BBC series was also for younger kids, and it didn’t seem like it was talking down to adults.  They both were simplified adaptations, and I don’t see why people would be offended at either of them being children’s movies.  They knew that from the very beginning. As for the Green Mist, it was not needed in the Walden film and they should have left it out. But it doesn’t seem fair to judge the whole film by that one mistake or call it a disaster, as Dr. Michael Ward referred to it.  Dr. Ward seems rather biased in condemning the whole movie. If you are going to be honest and truthful you have to say there is some good in the film.  The movie's good points include the fine acting by Will Poulter as Eustace, realism in the special effects, and the beautiful Dawn Treader ship. Although it is loosely based on the book, the plot is similar in some ways, and there are similar dangers and obstacles to overcome. I think they should have included more of them from the book, e.g. The Dark Island should have replaced the Green Mist.

Posted by: @coracle

@waggawerewolf27 

May I correct that detail about White Island?  Nobody did any filming on it for VDT; some backgrounds were filmed from a boat. Walden at least showed good judgement in not taking cast, crew or equipment onto a live volcano island.  

I'm so very glad and relieved to hear it. I'd actually believed in 2019, that Walden was lucky to get away with filming there, though White Island had been quiescent for some time, I've heard. That tourist tragedy should never have happened, then. To borrow from another franchise, put out by Warner Brothers: Never tickle a sleeping dragon.  

The idea that the younger viewers were the ones who loved Walden VDT best fits in with my early assessment of its being an exciting, visually interesting, adventure story, with a bratty boy, a cute young girl (not Lucy), and some funny stuff, a wonderful sea voyage on an amazing vintage sailing boat, and battles involving a sea serpent and a dragon.

If it failed to pay more than lip service to the book, it at least won my award for most ironic movie: it was a completely Disneyfied version of a mid-century kids' classic. It was so Disneyish, that it was hard to believe the producers did not include Disney but Fox [yes, who were later bought by Disney].

It definitely showed that Walden needed to get out of adapting existing stories, and write their own. Sadly, Netflix took up the awful adaptation task, and created some monsters.

[I'd like to see publishers put out "Now read the original book!" editions of a lot of these things. We can't expect 21st century readers to read a series of 7 books written 70 years ago, when they have pulp fiction magic and dark fantasy flooding the bookstores and libraries (usually all starting with the name of the main character). 
But we should encourage the parents of these children to introduce and read the books together, and talk about words and expressions that grandparents might have used, etc. ]

@coracle May I correct that detail about White Island?  Nobody did any filming on it for VDT; some backgrounds were filmed from a boat.

Whilst going through some old newspapers, I've just found the March 1st (2025) Daily Telegraph, p. 37 news item about the White Island eruption, reporting the New Zealand High Court's findings. Pointing out that the commercial operators ferrying those unfortunate tourists to the site, aptly called Dragon Island for the purposes of the VDT film photography, should have also been doing their own checks, and thus, paying more heed to the conditions. 

The idea that the younger viewers were the ones who loved Walden VDT best fits in with my early assessment of its being an exciting, visually interesting, adventure story, with a bratty boy, a cute young girl (not Lucy), and some funny stuff, a wonderful sea voyage on an amazing vintage sailing boat, and battles involving a sea serpent and a dragon.

You could also have mentioned the unnecessarily exaggerated battle with the slavers, for much of the same reasons you have mentioned. Was there any interview between Gumpas & King Caspian? Instead of portraying him as a lazy, chicken-hearted bureaucrat, obsessed with trade figures, I think he turned into an outright villain, in cahoots with the slavers, themselves. Thus, King Caspian's best lines in the book were missed, completely, defining what Narnia's King Caspian X stood for.  That goes along with Disney's treatment to dumb down movies for children's consumption to earn that all important "G" rating. Heaven forbid, that children should be exposed to hearing exactly what is wrong with slavery - oh, I forgot, King Caspian in his speech included tobacco and alcohol, adult substances, that children have been known to try behind parents' back, & which could have still been omitted in the film script if necessary. 

Similarly, the green mist was supposed to be a visual cue to indicate that "temptation" had occurred, as if children as old as 10 -12 years old can't work out what "temptation" might be unaided, and why it is wrong for them to help themselves to enticing objects in shops, without paying for them, or hurt animals etc. 

[I'd like to see publishers put out "Now read the original book!" editions of a lot of these things. We can't expect 21st century readers to read a series of 7 books written 70 years ago,

No, they won't do that when Warner Brothers made films out of a series of 7 books, another "septet", all published as recently as 2007 into 8 films, plus at least 3 spin-off movies etc to earn more money. And not when any sort of mild romance is shoved in to befit the teenaged categories of audiences, as a nod that the Pevensies of LWW have grown older. 

It is not only C.S. Lewis' books that might be bowdlerised in film versions, but if you read original copies of Enid Blyton's books as opposed to those on sale now, you might find they have been sanitized in comparison with their 1st editions.